The US Supreme Court wants a response from Pennsylvania by noon today in a challenge to Governor Tom Wolf's shutdown March 19 order. A divided Pa. Supreme Court has already dismissed arguments that this closure violates the United States Constitution.
Harrisburg lawyer Marc A. Scaringi has asked the High Court to stay enforcement of Governor Wolf's shutdown pending review of his appeal. He represents state house candidate Danny DeVito; Northampton County realtor Kathy Gregory; B&J LAUNDRY, LLC, Blueberry Hill Public Golf Course & Lounge; and Caledonia Land Company. These kinds of applications are only rarely granted. Attorney Scaringi, however, argues that "[u]nless this Court grants this application to stay and ultimately grants the Petition for Writ of Certiorari on its merits, Petitioners and tens of thousands of other businesses may not be able to recover from the severe financial distresscaused by the Order." He adds that Pennsylvania's shutdown is "similar to other business closure orders issued by governors in states across the U.S. The same or similar U.S. Constitutional rights are implicated in these business closures. Thus, this case not only has great significance to the people of Pennsylvanian, it has great significance to business owners throughout the U.S."
Governor Wolf has recently changed his Order so that golf courses can now operate.
Updated 11:30 am: The State Responds! - In an amendment to his original application, Attorney Scaringi argues that "actual evidence, not the projections used to form the basis of the Governor’s orders, reveals that lockdown orders like the Executive Order and Stay-At-Home order are doing more harm than good."
The state's response, located here, argues that there has been no showing that the rights of the impacted small businesses are "indisputably clear" and hence no basis for a stay.
64 comments:
Gov. Wolf will win again. Then Bernie can call the members of the Court "elitist", because that's what he does.
By now, Pennsylvania citizens realize our state government is making-up the rules ‘on the fly.’ Wolf and others are making decisions on faulty data, and have created a re-opening plan that will only drag this out into the month of June, maybe longer. Who, and by what reasoning, designed the 8-10 County groupings?
Who, and by what reasoning, designated the formula 50 new cases per 100K? Why is the ‘approved list of businesses’ being kept secret?
Why is the fate of Pennsylvanians tied together with the management of 5 other states, especially New York State? Where is the audited list of all medical equipment and PPD available within each Pennsylvania County?
Pennsylvania is not responding to this event nearly as well as other states. All states, open and closed, are dealing with the same Federal Agencies. Let’s direct our frustration to where it best belongs . . . . . Pennsylvania politicians!
Elitists like you are really bothered at being called out for what you are. Too bad.
This case is not in a good position for victory bc golf courses can now operate and it is very rare for a court to grant a stay. Courts are loathe to enter stays. But on the merits, the US S Ct would reverse.
Remember the debate about the bi-County Health department Bernie? What say you now?
Yes, people just love all the sickness and, especially, death. We are really catching on to the advantages. For one thing, now we can have Grandpa and Grandpa's car, which was driven only once a week to pick up medication. We'll really miss them, but hey--where there's a will, there's a way.
9:12 - I get the humor. I also find humor in anyone under the age of, say 50, who detests older, financially secure people who prospered under a ‘different’ America. We elderly were, indeed, lucky, in addition to being hardworking and good with money management over time.
The generation before mine should understand they, and their families, are facing MANY more years of difficult times catching-up. Huge tax increases coming up, and those taxes are ‘gonna last well into their own retirements! If retirement even comes to them.
Yes, it's now our job to get out of their way.
You certainly can't say much for the clothing.
"Remember the debate about the bi-County Health department Bernie? What say you now?"
Completely opposed. Counties with public health departments were hit very hard. Did not see their health departments as having made a difference. Also, the state DOH is laughable. It is headed by a pediatrician. There is not one epidemiologist on staff.
Wolf has lost the "initiative". The amount of people out and about this past weekend was amazing. Traffic was typical of the Lehigh Valley on a weekend. Shopping center's with Costco, Walmart, Lowes, all the big boxes were booming. Wawa and convenience stores had typical traffic. Fast food drive thru's were lined up out to the streets. Pizzeria's had people picking up take out. The only thing missing were non big box retail stores, bars, sit down restaurants. Those owners are on the outside looking in!
Time to reopen now. If you are scared to go out, stay home! If you want to go out and are concerned, wear a mask, eye protection, social distance, washy washy and don't touch your face. You will be fine.
Oh, I'll stay home so that I can be there when you call from the hospital.
Bernie O'Hare said...
Elitists like you are really bothered at being called out for what you are. Too bad.
This case is not in a good position for victory bc golf courses can now operate and it is very rare for a court to grant a stay. Courts are loathe to enter stays. But on the merits, the US S Ct would reverse.
May 4, 2020 at 9:09 AM
See--ALREADY you're with the name-calling again. Your have quite the problem there.
But at least you seem to understand that the Supreme Court is not likely to overrule the Gov. But the merits of the case are with his enemies and he's such a dictator, how is that possible? A guess we just need someone with your level of non-elite magnificence to explain that to us.
If you want to delay something indefinitely, hand the assignment over to a politician or a court. You might need to wait a few years for a resolution, but that’s just the way it is.
And I suppose you're a person of real fast action, eh? So why don't you draft an opinion for the Supreme Court that will save them some time? What, you don't know how to do that? What a shock.
Why is the Supreme Court's decision supposedly only about golf? I thought that people were being arrested for daring to pray.
The lockdown is pointless either way. Montgomery county here, loads of ppl out and abou . Big business thriving. Only the small businessmen and self employed are hurting, and they will remember it.
So maybe it's time to enforce the Gov.'s orders against violators.
Good idea. Thanks!
From The Hill:
The Trump administration is projecting that the United States could see up to 3,000 deaths per day from the coronavirus on June 1, according to internal documents obtained by The New York Times.
So, let's see: at the current rate for May that would be another 60,000 deaths, and another 90,000 for each month after that.
I'm getting so very tired of winning.
From PA Dept. Public Health:
Cases across the state are expected to increase at an exponential rate. Because of limited testing and other factors, experts believe the virus is far more widespread than case counts suggest.
Cases: 49,267
Deaths: 2,444
12:48 - I no longer trust anything provided by The Hill, or the New York Times. Regardless, increasing the amount of testing will increase the amount of proven/presumed new cases. Most of which will be from persons with no noticeable symptoms, and not even needing hospitalization.
PLEASE READ Attorney Scaringi's amendment after Bernies UPDATE. Specifically Exhibits D-H. The exhibits are testimony from actual PA small business owners. They are representative of whats happening in every town and city in PA because of this overreach. SCOTUS may be our only chance to reopen.
I'm a small business owner, but I still don't want to die from the virus.
We should reopen when the experts say we should. The White House is ignoring its own guidelines. What does that tell you?
I see no mention of this in the local press. Seems to me to be a big story. have I missed it?
Just look up the White House guidelines that were announced a couple of weeks ago. As I recall, one detail is that a state or area shouldn't reopen until they have at least five days of steady decline in new cases.
Herr Wolf has been in hiding since Friday. As the nursing home crisis gets worse, he remains silent. That's leadership, right?
I suspect he's in his office doing real work. The rest of us are just blogging.
Who's the better person?
Bette question: who's really the Nazi?
Anon 1:33 said "I'm a small business owner, but I still don't want to die from the virus."
Then by all means, stay shut until the experts you trust say it's safe. Then reopen if you want.
You should be able to make that choice.
But eventually I have to run some errands at essential businesses, and unfortunately I'm going to be in proximity to a mouth-breather such as yourself. I don't recognize any right on your part to infect me with a deadly virus. I'm just funny that way, I guess.
If you support reopening, then support wearing masks. You can't have it both ways--or shouldn't, anyway.
2:19 -
Uh, no.
If you want to wear masks, please wear them.
But they're not the one-way protection lie you're getting from politicians.
12:57 PM
"From PA Dept. Public Health:
Cases across the state are expected to increase at an exponential rate. Because of limited testing and other factors, experts believe the virus is far more widespread than case counts suggest."
Here we go again.
But now I see where the dim-witted have gone awry. That quote is from way back in March. It's never been removed from the sites that publish up-dated "tracker" information.
https://www.ncnewsonline.com/pennsylvania-coronavirus-case-tracker/html_9c72a142-6ae3-11ea-b8ae-5b1bcdafb2f3.html
Again, if you believe the DOH thinks cases will go up exponentially from here, Gov. Wolf's got some 'splaining to do, since he's willing to conduct a "grand experiment" by easing some restrictions.
Anonymous said...
2:19 -
Uh, no.
If you want to wear masks, please wear them.
But they're not the one-way protection lie you're getting from politicians.
May 4, 2020 at 2:42 PM
I recall several experts, including Drs. Birx and Gupta, say this. Apparently the wearer may get some protection, but its mostly someone who is near the wearer of the mask who benefits.
What's your point, that no one benefits from masks? If so, your qualifications or sources are what?
Anonymous said...
2:17 -
I don't have the virus.
If I did, and I was under a court-ordered quarantine, you might have a point. Even not having the virus, if I deliberately got in your face and coughed on you, you might also have a point.
But if I haven't been diagnosed, and I'm not trying to make you think I'm getting you sick, you have no point. And you and your leftist politicians have no right to force me to wear a mask.
I guess I'm funny like that also, even though I may (or may not) be wearing a mask - by choice.
May 4, 2020 at 2:53 PM
Actually, you don't know whether you have the virus. And I certainly don't.
I believe the government is within its powers to enforce the wearing of masks in some situations, and I hope that they will try to do so. That MY choice.
1:51 PM
" As I recall, one detail is that a state or area shouldn't reopen until they have at least five days of steady decline in new cases."
It's 14 days.
https://www.whitehouse.gov/openingamerica/#criteria
"Downward tracectory"
The most logical way to do that is a 14 day moving average.
The Lehigh Valley (NC + LC) has had a steadily decreasing 14 day moving average since the middle of April, which because of the math, encompasses data from the beginning of April. Since the State doesn't make data available in tabular form, you'll have to go to the PSU site and pick out the individual data points yourself if you want to check my work.
Here's the link to that supposedly non-existent report that the Trump administration apparently is using for projected fatalities:
https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthelper/6926-mayhhsbriefing/af7319f4a55fd0ce5dc9/optimized/full.pdf#page=1
So much for the left-wing conspiracy.
The White House guidelines for reopening call for a 14-day downward trajectory. No state has met that yet.
Then why is Trump telling everyone to reopen?
Because he's seriously confused.
I actively supported the concept but see zero reason to think that a Bi County Health Department would be promoting a rational nonpartisan strategy.
And what would a partisan strategy look like?
"The White House guidelines for reopening call for a 14-day downward trajectory. No state has met that yet."
May 4, 2020 at 3:42 PM
The guidelines say "State or Region." That's why I quoted LV data.
But Florida and Louisiana look about ready.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
That site doesn't have all the state graphs yet, but Georgia data look good too.
https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report
There are probably others.
I gather that Gov. Wolf has organized the state into regions precisely in order to take a regional approach. Therefore, I don't believe that counties will be the unit of analysis.
That's why I did the Lehigh Valley. Do you think those other sparsely populated counties in the "Region" are going to change things significantly?
Don't know. The general data that look to be coming in the next couple of weeks don't appear to be likely to support reopening.
4:40 PM
Can only analyze data that exist. Of course, if my intent was to justify keeping the region locked down, I could use all kinds of things that might happen.
The statistics are flawed and one sided for failing states, just wanting to hit the FED for more cash. Didn't here wolf have an infamous meeting with a elder abuse team captain some time ago. It seems that whole years so design is one of many reasons the state is failing miserably. I for one cannot still understand the steel and concrete base with wooden stick framing on top because of the dangers?
History lessons from The Lumber Yard, now claiming custom homes yet it's all off the shelf and nothing custom about it except calling and painting making a taint what it ain't gender specific! Maybe that's the customization of a house of a different colour?
Are you going to file an Amicus brief Bernie? You have been on this from day 1.
I don't like how the issues are framed and have a problem with using a golf course as one of the petitioners. I also disagree with the contention that the shutdown constitutes an unlawful taking. I do think there's a First Amendment issue, but no church has joined. To me, this whole case hinges on post-deprivation procedural due process. There was no notice or opportunity to be heard. There was no consultation with business. Wolf has refused to be transparent about the waiver process. But this is no basis for a stay. It is a basis for a successful appeal, seeking a remand to develop a record on inadequacies in the waiver process. There should also be a record concerning the inability of small business to get loans or seek unemployment bc Wolf has still failed to set it up properly.
2:01 said:
"I suspect he's in his office doing real work. The rest of us are just blogging."
Who's the better person?
Curling up in the fetal position and crying yourself to sleep does not make you a better person.
The governor continues to ignore the 800-pound gorilla in the room - nursing homes.
Don't we deserve an answer as to why?
2:01 said:
"I suspect he's in his office doing real work. The rest of us are just blogging."
Who's the better person?
Curling up in the fetal position and crying yourself to sleep doesn't make you a better person.
Our governor continues to ignore the 800-pound gorilla in the room - nursing homes.
You call that "doing real work?"
I stand corrected. Att'y Scaringi has supplemented his brief to include statements from several small business owners.
The government likely will win. An emergency is an emergency.
If I'm a judge, I don't want to force a state to reopen just to see the number of cases or deaths skyrocket--as may well happen.
Bennie, I think the idea of a bi-county health department must be reviewed. The area is larger and the need may be great. New eyes and minds must review the needs of the community. Some people oppose change out of fear. We must protect our citizens.
Don't oppose progress. County leaders should consider.
Doc Rock said...
2:01 said:
"I suspect he's in his office doing real work. The rest of us are just blogging."
Who's the better person?
Curling up in the fetal position and crying yourself to sleep doesn't make you a better person.
Our governor continues to ignore the 800-pound gorilla in the room - nursing homes.
You call that "doing real work?"
May 4, 2020 at 7:23 PM
Compared to your paper route? You bet.
Bernie O'Hare said...
To me, this whole case hinges on post-deprivation procedural due process. ...It is a basis for a successful appeal, seeking a remand to develop a record on inadequacies in the waiver process.
May 4, 2020 at 7:14 PM
Strongly disagree. In the middle of a HEALTH EMERGENCY, the state government is not in a position to suddenly hold thousands, if not tens of thousands, of administrative trials. There's a reason that courts have been mostly closed, which continues even after all these weeks.
What part of "emergency" don't you get?
try
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/496448-supreme-court-declines-to-lift-pennsylvania-health-order
"The court’s denial of the request, issued without comment, means fewer than five of the nine justices supported the petition."
Guess there is always the Hague
Stay safe everyone.
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