Ho dee ho ho I told you so. I asked before how you could be so naive to think that Simpson would overturn the voter I.D. Law. You gave me all that malarkey about being a good man etc. etc. etc. and I told you BALONEY. He is a Republican through and through and knows where his bread is buttered. Now on to the next in his political (and don't tell me the Judges aren't political) career. He wants to run statewide for the Courts highest target. State Supreme Court. You sure blew this one Bernie.
Too bad donors to 501(c)(4)s do not have to be identified (other than by the color of their money).
The Republicans have been brutally shrewd in PA between the gerrymandering, the failed attempt to peg presidential electors to the winners of those gerrymandered districts, and the Voter ID law under the specious ruse of fighting nonexistent fraud.
Are there any figures out that demonstrate a projected total of people that will not be able to commit active suffrage because they do not have the proper forms of identification?
I'm getting tired of this mantra that there's no voter fraud in PA. Spend a day in Philly and then talk about it.
Yes, the state did not claim voter fraud in their legal filing. That's because the US Supreme Court has already ruled that voter ID laws do not have to argue that fraud exists - there already has been enough precedent showing that it exists.
The judge was fair in this case AND came to the right conclusion. Let the hysteria begin.
You said Simpson could throw it out because there was no fraud..Apparently he disagreed. He essentially said the state legislature can pass a law that's onerous even if it sucks..
Fair? How do you know he was fair? Just by virtue of his authority and making the ruling? You've got some 'splainin" to do if you want to be taken seriously. In my view, putting impediments in the way of the old, the poor is anything but fair. But then, you are a Republican, aren't you?
The state's legal filing did not allege voter fraud because the US Supreme Court has set the precedent that voter fraud does not have to be demonstrated in arguments about voter ID laws. Fraud has already been proven in enough prior cases across the country that it no longer has to be shown in each new court case.
But it's ok to put impediments in front of people to drive, get certain medications, and a dozen other things?
And why are the old or the poor more affected by this than others? We all assume that they've already provided valid ID to receive any benefits (Welfare, social security, etc) that they receive.
Maybe the bigger story is that our government isn't checking for ID before doling out our tax dollars.
If there's a minor problem like you cite, and IF the voter is denied the opportunity to vote, they vote provisionally and have 7 days to prove they are who they are.
Other than an attempt by those TRYING to cause delays and use it as a political statement, there are likely to be few delays because of the new law.
This law WILL suppress the vote in PA make no mistake. Dowd and others like him who must go through another step or have their vote not count just because they left out their middle name on their photo id are going to experience it first hand. Voting should be encouraged NOT discouraged. There are as many as 3/4 of a million people in PA who do not have "acceptable" ids to vote under this new law. This is not democracy. To whomever is hedging their racism by commenting on "Philly" as the only problem I would invite you to imagine how many folks in the middle of the PA nether regions have just the right name, etc. and id. They are mostly Republicans but will also be denied. The ability to produce "proper" voter id under this undemocratic law is based on education and access....people will be left out for all kinds of reasons including logistics.
The list you cite is merely a listing of discrepancies between voter ID lists and the drivers license data base. Most of the discrepancies are relatively minor. It is not an indication of who will and will not be able to vote.
The whole impact is being exaggerated by the democrats to whip up their kook-fringe base.
Fraud? Maybe. Rationale doesn't matter because the law was legally passed. Remember, one lawyer's health care penalty may really be a tax. False advertising isn't unconstitutional. Elections have consequences.
My elderly Mother would not know where her photo ID is. She has not driven for decades. Does not need it for medical appointments. Does not need it for her banking. Her name is misspelled on her birth certificate. The utility bills are in my fathers name. A women who helped so many during her lifetime is not qualified to vote.
Amen. It's August and they'll accept about 50 different forms of I.D. If you're smart enough to wax sadly here, you're smart enough to get your momma an I.D.. Kids are frickin' heartless these days.
1:34, Is your fight with Judge Simpson or with me? I know he was fair bc he has always been fair. I also read his opinion. I happen to disagree with him, but there is no doubt in my mind that he ruled the way he felt the law and facts warranted. You're entitled to conclude that I must be a R bc i thought the judge as fair.
"Voting should be encouraged NOT discouraged. There are as many as 3/4 of a million people in PA who do not have "acceptable" ids to vote under this new law. This is not democracy."
I agree. We seem to be going in the wrong direction.
The ID's allowed are very nuanced. The bull being spat by the teabaggers is crazy. There are very spcific items written into the law that will disenfranchise many, mainly urban voters.
As one of the teabagger authors of the Bill stated, this is about getting Mittens Roomney a win in Pennsylvania.
Very sad, the once noble Republican Party is now the Party of Jefferson Davis.
If your Democrat readers don't like the ruling they may want to check the supreme court ruling by none other than Justice Stevens, Crawford V Marion County. In that case the justice agreed that Indiana's voter ID law was OKIE DOKIE!
Bernie, I respect your opinion, but I cannot fathom where you are coming from on this one.
Last week, I had to show my photo ID twice when I wrote checks. I have shown photo ID at St. Luke's North, in the past year, even though I have been regularly getting INR blood tests there for 15 years, due to Warfarin use. I needed photo ID at the bank not long ago, in a branch where they did not recognize me. I am absolutely certain that one needs photo ID to apply for food stamps. My friend needed a photo ID to take a CD out of the public library the other day.
I consider myself "elderly", being near 70, haven't driven in 15 years due to a heart rhythm disturbance, still renew my driver's license.
When my elderly mother determined at age 85 she would never drive again, I sent her driver's licence to the State driver's license agency, and they sent her a non-driver's photo ID by return mail. Anybody who does not have a driver's license can go in person, have a photo taken, and get one of these photo IDs.
I think it is childish, all this whining about not being able to get a photo ID, not being able to find the driver's license, blah, blah, blah. If you can go vote, you can go get a photo ID.
Give me a break already, you need I D to buy beer and cigarettes and to get a job in this country, there is no discrimination here.
Sure, young people do. How often do they card a 60 year old man for beer and cigarettes? Get a clue, genius. And get your head out of your ass and walk into any nursing home and find out how many people have valid photo IDs. Or go to some inner city row homes in Philadelphia where people have no need to drive or have an id to buy beer.
Yes, because its the "kooks" in the Democratic Party who want to assign personhood to an egg effectively making birth control illegal and users murderers AND its the "kooks" in the Democratic Party who favor trans-vaginal ultrasounds on women against their will.
Good thing there's plenty of time for you to help your mother get her life straightened out and get a proper ID before November.
First of all, there is not a lot of time. Second, not every elderly person has a child living nearby or have a child at all. Nice try though, genius. Your party is full of brilliant ideas.
The use of the state report that 758,000 voters do not have ID is a wild exageration.
The Phila Inquirer did a report based on extensive testing of the data. They found the numbers reported to be highly inflated. It can still be an issue if only 1,000 people are excluded, but the large number is imginary.
Lots of problems in comparing voter lists to drivers lists.
* Almost all names with hyphens and/or "Mc/Mac/Cc/cC/" show up as mismatches. For example the supreme court justice Shmamus McCafrey was on the list.
* licenses expiring in the next couple months tended to be on the list.
The Phila Inquirer is no right wing advocate so I think they did a good job reviewing and paring the numbers down to a fraction of 758,000.
Hey assholes....I don't need an I.D. to buy cigarettes. I don't need an I.D. to buy beer. I'm eighty years old and no one cards me. Go get bent you jerkoffs. I don't get carded in the whorehouses in Neveda either. I may have trouble getting it up but they don't ask me who's getting it up? No I.d.
"First of all, there is not a lot of time. Second, not every elderly person has a child living nearby or have a child at all. Nice try though, genius. Your party is full of brilliant ideas."
If they need that much help, are they really qualified to make a coherent choice to vote?
45 comments:
Ho dee ho ho I told you so. I asked before how you could be so naive to think that Simpson would overturn the voter I.D. Law. You gave me all that malarkey about being a good man etc. etc. etc. and I told you BALONEY. He is a Republican through and through and knows where his bread is buttered. Now on to the next in his political (and don't tell me the Judges aren't political) career. He wants to run statewide for the Courts highest target. State Supreme Court. You sure blew this one Bernie.
I did not predict how Judge Simpson would rule. I did predict he would be fair. he was.
Too bad donors to 501(c)(4)s do not have to be identified (other than by the color of their money).
The Republicans have been brutally shrewd in PA between the gerrymandering, the failed attempt to peg presidential electors to the winners of those gerrymandered districts, and the Voter ID law under the specious ruse of fighting nonexistent fraud.
i just don't see how people have no forms of ID? Its mind boggling.
Are there any figures out that demonstrate a projected total of people that will not be able to commit active suffrage because they do not have the proper forms of identification?
Peace be with you, ~~~alex+
I'm getting tired of this mantra that there's no voter fraud in PA. Spend a day in Philly and then talk about it.
Yes, the state did not claim voter fraud in their legal filing. That's because the US Supreme Court has already ruled that voter ID laws do not have to argue that fraud exists - there already has been enough precedent showing that it exists.
The judge was fair in this case AND came to the right conclusion. Let the hysteria begin.
Judge must be a Racist.
ROLF OELER
Judge probably wants to put people in chains, too.
Joe Biden can fill in the blanks for those who have no idea what I am talking about ...
ROLF OELER
Give me a break already, you need I D to buy beer and cigarettes and to get a job in this country, there is no discrimination here.
You said Simpson could throw it out because there was no fraud..Apparently he disagreed. He essentially said the state legislature can pass a law that's onerous even if it sucks..
Dear moronic 12:09,
Even the state recognized there was no fraud..Guess you know better..Give us your evidence Mr. Know it all..
Fair? How do you know he was fair? Just by virtue of his authority and making the ruling? You've got some 'splainin" to do if you want to be taken seriously. In my view, putting impediments in the way of the old, the poor is anything but fair. But then, you are a Republican, aren't you?
1:12 -
Please read this slowly so you can understand:
The state's legal filing did not allege voter fraud because the US Supreme Court has set the precedent that voter fraud does not have to be demonstrated in arguments about voter ID laws. Fraud has already been proven in enough prior cases across the country that it no longer has to be shown in each new court case.
Stop trying to confuse the issue.
The fraud ship has sailed. It exists. Move on.
But it's ok to put impediments in front of people to drive, get certain medications, and a dozen other things?
And why are the old or the poor more affected by this than others? We all assume that they've already provided valid ID to receive any benefits (Welfare, social security, etc) that they receive.
Maybe the bigger story is that our government isn't checking for ID before doling out our tax dollars.
Even old ex-county coucil memeber Dowd has no legaql ID. If your name is not exactly on your license the way it is on the registar books, no vote.
This will be a clusterfuck on election day for voters.
Is that rebellion in the air? Ah, the last desperate act of exctremous. You disenfranchise people who don't vote the weay they want.
This is teabagger democracy in action folks.
If there's a minor problem like you cite, and IF the voter is denied the opportunity to vote, they vote provisionally and have 7 days to prove they are who they are.
Other than an attempt by those TRYING to cause delays and use it as a political statement, there are likely to be few delays because of the new law.
This law WILL suppress the vote in PA make no mistake. Dowd and others like him who must go through another step or have their vote not count just because they left out their middle name on their photo id are going to experience it first hand.
Voting should be encouraged NOT discouraged. There are as many as 3/4 of a million people in PA who do not have "acceptable" ids to vote under this new law. This is not democracy. To whomever is hedging their racism by commenting on "Philly" as the only problem I would invite you to imagine how many folks in the middle of the PA nether regions have just the right name, etc. and id. They are mostly Republicans but will also be denied. The ability to produce "proper" voter id under this undemocratic law is based on education and access....people will be left out for all kinds of reasons including logistics.
The list you cite is merely a listing of discrepancies between voter ID lists and the drivers license data base. Most of the discrepancies are relatively minor. It is not an indication of who will and will not be able to vote.
The whole impact is being exaggerated by the democrats to whip up their kook-fringe base.
If you can't win change the rules
oh well just another non-issue. Either you can prove who you are or you can't. Both sides are babbling about nothing
Hey "ticky", if ignorance is bliss, you must be ecstatic!
Fraud? Maybe. Rationale doesn't matter because the law was legally passed. Remember, one lawyer's health care penalty may really be a tax. False advertising isn't unconstitutional. Elections have consequences.
My elderly Mother would not know where her photo ID is. She has not driven for decades. Does not need it for medical appointments. Does not need it for her banking. Her name is misspelled on her birth certificate. The utility bills are in my fathers name. A women who helped so many during her lifetime is not qualified to vote.
Good thing there's plenty of time for you to help your mother get her life straightened out and get a proper ID before November.
Amen. It's August and they'll accept about 50 different forms of I.D. If you're smart enough to wax sadly here, you're smart enough to get your momma an I.D.. Kids are frickin' heartless these days.
1:34, Is your fight with Judge Simpson or with me? I know he was fair bc he has always been fair. I also read his opinion. I happen to disagree with him, but there is no doubt in my mind that he ruled the way he felt the law and facts warranted. You're entitled to conclude that I must be a R bc i thought the judge as fair.
"Voting should be encouraged NOT discouraged. There are as many as 3/4 of a million people in PA who do not have "acceptable" ids to vote under this new law. This is not democracy."
I agree. We seem to be going in the wrong direction.
I never get asked for I'd to buy beer or booze at the state store
Bernie,
Only Citizens who PAY Taxes should be allowed to VOTE!
The ID's allowed are very nuanced. The bull being spat by the teabaggers is crazy. There are very spcific items written into the law that will disenfranchise many, mainly urban voters.
As one of the teabagger authors of the Bill stated, this is about getting Mittens Roomney a win in Pennsylvania.
Very sad, the once noble Republican Party is now the Party of Jefferson Davis.
if yo mama don't have an ID how do u know ur not a bastard?
dem losers crying again because their messiah can't win without illegals
Court decisions are a bitch. Sometimes a penalty is really a tax.
Bernie,
If your Democrat readers don't like the ruling they may want to check the supreme court ruling by none other than Justice Stevens, Crawford V Marion County. In that case the justice agreed that Indiana's voter ID law was OKIE DOKIE!
Really enjoying this one.
Scott Armstrong
Anon 754 said
"Only Citizens who PAY Taxes should be allowed to VOTE!"
One could argue the same point to run for President.
There is no denying a person making 30K a year without sheltered money pays a higher rate of their income than Romney.
"There are as many as 3/4 of a million people in PA who do not have "acceptable" ids to vote under this new law."
Guess that means there a a lot of heartless kids.
Don't need voter ID for an absentee.
Bernie, I respect your opinion, but I cannot fathom where you are coming from on this one.
Last week, I had to show my photo ID twice when I wrote checks. I have shown photo ID at St. Luke's North, in the past year, even though I have been regularly getting INR blood tests there for 15 years, due to Warfarin use. I needed photo ID at the bank not long ago, in a branch where they did not recognize me. I am absolutely certain that one needs photo ID to apply for food stamps. My friend needed a photo ID to take a CD out of the public library the other day.
I consider myself "elderly", being near 70, haven't driven in 15 years due to a heart rhythm disturbance, still renew my driver's license.
When my elderly mother determined at age 85 she would never drive again, I sent her driver's licence to the State driver's license agency, and they sent her a non-driver's photo ID by return mail. Anybody who does not have a driver's license can go in person, have a photo taken, and get one of these photo IDs.
I think it is childish, all this whining about not being able to get a photo ID, not being able to find the driver's license, blah, blah, blah. If you can go vote, you can go get a photo ID.
Whats the chance of a 90 year old in a nursing home having a valid photo ID? Zero.
This is a shameless move to get Romney PA as voiced by some Republican legislator in no uncertain terms.
Give me a break already, you need I D to buy beer and cigarettes and to get a job in this country, there is no discrimination here.
Sure, young people do. How often do they card a 60 year old man for beer and cigarettes? Get a clue, genius. And get your head out of your ass and walk into any nursing home and find out how many people have valid photo IDs. Or go to some inner city row homes in Philadelphia where people have no need to drive or have an id to buy beer.
the democrats to whip up their kook-fringe base
Yes, because its the "kooks" in the Democratic Party who want to assign personhood to an egg effectively making birth control illegal and users murderers AND its the "kooks" in the Democratic Party who favor trans-vaginal ultrasounds on women against their will.
Yeah WE'RE kooky. Go grab your Bible, genius.
Good thing there's plenty of time for you to help your mother get her life straightened out and get a proper ID before November.
First of all, there is not a lot of time. Second, not every elderly person has a child living nearby or have a child at all. Nice try though, genius. Your party is full of brilliant ideas.
The use of the state report that 758,000 voters do not have ID is a wild exageration.
The Phila Inquirer did a report based on extensive testing of the data. They found the numbers reported to be highly inflated. It can still be an issue if only 1,000 people are excluded, but the large number is imginary.
Lots of problems in comparing voter lists to drivers lists.
* Almost all names with hyphens and/or "Mc/Mac/Cc/cC/" show up as mismatches. For example the supreme court justice Shmamus McCafrey was on the list.
*
licenses expiring in the next couple months tended to be on the list.
The Phila Inquirer is no right wing advocate so I think they did a good job reviewing and paring the numbers down to a fraction of 758,000.
Hey assholes....I don't need an I.D. to buy cigarettes. I don't need an I.D. to buy beer. I'm eighty years old and no one cards me. Go get bent you jerkoffs. I don't get carded in the whorehouses in Neveda either. I may have trouble getting it up but they don't ask me who's getting it up? No I.d.
Apparently you didn't need an ID to whine here either.
Now why don't you spend the next 2.5 MONTHS productively by getting a valid ID? Otherwise, put in for an absentee ballot.
Either way, not really a hardship, is it? And your new ID might help you get to Nevada even quicker, since you'll be able to fly.
"First of all, there is not a lot of time. Second, not every elderly person has a child living nearby or have a child at all. Nice try though, genius. Your party is full of brilliant ideas."
If they need that much help, are they really qualified to make a coherent choice to vote?
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