My NIZ in a Nutshell post reveals that the downtown NIZ will produce 750 jobs. With a projected $220 million bond for the arena complex, and a debt service of around $500 million, Doc Roc aptly observes that we'll be spending about $667,000 for each job created.
Does this make sense?
Blogger Michael Molovisnky notes that even this figure is low. The arena bond is only the first of many bonds to be floated. But only 750 jobs will be produced in the downtown NIZ
Today's one-liner: "The shortest way to the distinguishing excellence of any writer is through his hostile critics." Richard LeGallienne
Local Government TV
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Friday, May 04, 2012
35 comments:
You own views are appreciated, especially if they differ from mine. But remember, commenting is a privilege, not a right. I will delete personal attacks or off-topic remarks at my discretion. Comments that play into the tribalism that has consumed this nation will be declined. So will comments alleging voter fraud unless backed up by concrete evidence. If you attack someone personally, I expect you to identify yourself. I will delete criticisms of my comment policy, vulgarities, cut-and-paste jobs from other sources and any suggestion of violence towards anyone. I will also delete sweeping generalizations about mainstream parties or ideologies, i.e. identity politics. My decisions on these matters are made on a case by case basis, and may be affected by my mood that day, my access to the blog at the time the comment was made or other information that isn’t readily apparent.
Your right...this doesn't make sense. You can never recoup that money through taxes on jobs created. Are they going to share their tax revenues and any windfall monies with sourounding municipalities like Northampton county did with Casino Revenues. This is another case of GOVERNMENT GOING NUTS. How many years do they figure it will take to recoup all those dollars....i.e. wage taxes, amusement taxes, income taxes, property taxes, school taxes, etc., etc. We have got to throw the rotten bastards out of office. Remember this the next time they come up for re-election.
ReplyDeleteThis about a white pasttime for white people. Period.
ReplyDeleteLOL maybe if you completely ignore the value of the buildings. You should stick to being wrong about flex time.
ReplyDeleteLiberals do not know how to create jobs. They create entitlements; this time, for the already rich. Geeting likes empty buildings. They offer lots of opportunities for liasons.
ReplyDeleteJon Geeting should stick to dancing on the graves of dead guys ...
ReplyDeleteMr. Geeting,
ReplyDeleteMedical science has made great progress in treating people with the attention span of a canary.
Ritalin, for example.
The NIZ will have to generate NEW taxes of more than $22,000 a year per new job for the taxpayer to "break even."
That's not existing taxes, that's NEW taxes.
Since every announced tenant in the NIZ is based in the Lehigh Valley already, ZERO NEW TAXES have been created so far.
And when the NIZ depresses office rents all over the Valley, property tax revenues will decline as a result of the NIZ. As will state income taxes and EIT.
Got that?
The buildings actually will have a low value because the rent stream will be so low.
ReplyDeleteAnother little slice of reality that Geeting doesn't know anything about since they didn't cover it in policy class.
And Geeting is confusing the cost of the buildings with their value, two entirely different things.
ReplyDeleteTheir value, because of their location in downtown Allentown, will never be significant.
Bernie, I have to apologize, I know you have a policy against name calling, but let's face it Geeting is a moron.
Anon 10:56 is exactly eight. My building downtown is insured for three times the value, since the cost to rebuild is three times higher than the market value as my rental income is already depressed for being in allentown. The Niz will only make it worse by forcing down rents. It's all about cash flow. I thing Mr. Geeting means well but is just too inexperienced or naive to understand.
Delete1:56 Moron def A person of borderline intelligence ........., having an intelligence quotient of 50-69. That IQ is to high for Geeting...He is an idiot with an IQ of less than 30
ReplyDeleteCould you use your special "math science" to tell us all how much money Northampton County lost when John Stoffa signed over half of the Casino fees to Allentown and Lehigh county?
ReplyDeleteWith looming Human Services and Corrections deficits, it would be helpful to know how much Northampton County taxpayers lost in Mr. Stoffa's nod to regional cooperation.
Worked then but not now, very interesting.
Who are you people? Seriously. Take a walk downtown sometime it's nice.
ReplyDeleteDoc rock's numbers appear to be extremely exagerated. Present the math instead of bombastic claims.
ReplyDeleteThe NIZ will depress the office market just like KOZ, RCAP and other programs did. Saying it will is unfounded fear mongering.
ReplyDeleteBernie,
ReplyDeleteThis makes perfect sense!
"Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteDoc rock's numbers appear to be extremely exagerated. Present the math instead of bombastic claims."
OK, here you go:
1) Over 30 years, debt service on the arena will be around $400 million, maybe more depending on how those bonds are rated;
2) Over 30 years, the arena will deteriorate and many components will have to be replaced. Based on previous arena projects, $100 million in renovations is a very conservative number;
3) $400 million + $100 million = $500 million (1st grade arithmetic);
4) $500 million/750 jobs = $667,000 per job (maybe that's 2nd or 3rd grade arithmetic!).
Even if Allentown does no renovations over the 30 years (good luck with that!), the cost is $533,000 per new job.
Class over, you may go to recess.
Bernie,
ReplyDeleteLet's do the Math on our FULL-TIME STATE SENATE and our REPRESENTAIVES and FULL-TIME STAFF MEMBERS!
Bernie,
ReplyDeleteLet's do the Math on our FULL-TIME STATE SENATE and our REPRESENTAIVES and FULL-TIME STAFF MEMBERS!
Very entertaining. Allentown is in a hole it will never be able to recover from. Move over Detroit. I wll bet this character Getting loves all the attention he receives on this blog. Think about it.
ReplyDeleteGeeting is free to comment here. I welcome different views.
ReplyDeleteAdjusted for inflation, the per job cost is consistent with bond-financed $186,000 parking spaces in Northampton County. politicians are not exactly bargain hunters. They waste money. Call cost overruns nice. Then, get things named after them. The system works.
ReplyDeleteI don't think he means well at all. If he did he would be proactive about what he says and really do something about it. Not just sit around a campfire and sing Kumbaiya. I see so many people both Dem, republicans, independents and tea party people really working hard in a POSITIVE way. A small way would be volunteering. Then you can put your hard money into action by using that to help your cause.
ReplyDeleteMr greeting. Tell me what have you done lately that has meaning and has changes lives.
Bernie,
ReplyDeleteGovernor Corbett is forwarding 30,000,000.00 in State Tax Dollars to Delta Airlines to assist in purchasing a Fuel processing plant near Phila.
Is any of our State Rep's upset over this use of tax payer funds.
CHECK IT OUT!
Bernie,
ReplyDeleteNIZtivas for the restavus!
By the mayor's own op-Ed in The Call today, the cost of the arena is now $2.1 million per new job created!
ReplyDeleteMarvelous. Simply marvelous!
who cares!
ReplyDeleteGreat mentality. It's why Allentown is in such great shape.
ReplyDeletebernie, who cares!is unfortunately spot on. pawlowski had an op ed piece in today's morning call. the mcall version only received 13 comments, two of which were mine, and one from jeff barber. maybe a total of 6 people commented. very few do seem to care.
ReplyDeleteI just want to point out that each municipality involved may end up spending more on legal fees than the actual EIT monies may be worth. Should we not at least count all the lawyers who have been employed as part of the Niz?! ;-)
ReplyDeletePeople in Allentown are certainly apathetic. It's why Pawlowski is Mayor. It's why he can get away with a rubber stamp council.
ReplyDeleteBut outside of Allentown?
Everything I see tells me Pawlowski is losing the PR war on this one. It's why he has to send Fleck in to shout you and Thode down. It's why he has op-eds in both papers.
Outside of one-party Allentown, people are wise to King Edwin. If they are any doubts, they'll be erased when they see Fleck's comments about Trexlertown tomorrow night, or they see Barber call hard-working minority merchants a "cancer" that needed to be cut. These are two of Pawlowski's minions, there at his behest, and they spoke for him.
There are few comments at MC bc (1) people have to provide better identifications, I'm told; and (2) the paywall chases people away. I have not commented there for several years. I was impersonated at that site.
The "deciders" in Allentown obviously decided a minority majority in downtown was undesirable and so the the "cancer" of minority merchants had to go. Now instead of the merchants taxes they have to depend on the taxes of the suburbs to exist. Watch what happens when these disapear (which seems likely).
ReplyDeleteIf each job lasts 20 years, sure.
ReplyDeleteAdd to that all of the revenue that will pour in as a side effect, you just made the case!
The NIZ will have to generate NEW taxes of more than $22,000 a year per new job for the taxpayer to "break even."
ReplyDeleteWondering if the "Doc" has computed taxes charged to all of the players, coaches, and performing artists that will be performing at the arena? Probably not.
bernie, who cares!is unfortunately spot on. pawlowski had an op ed piece in today's morning call. the mcall version only received 13 comments, two of which were mine, and one from jeff barber. maybe a total of 6 people commented. very few do seem to care.
ReplyDeleteI certainly care. I care about seeing the Phantoms player and some good concerts now and then. Hopefully, the curmudgeons here will use a crowbar on their wallets for a couple bucks.
Let's not forget the $800,000 per job the OBAMA stimulas cost. And that assumes those jobs actually were created???
ReplyDelete