I want to start out by commending Jay Bradley and Lehigh Valley News for an exceptionally well-written summary of the LV passenger rail study made public on Wednesday afternoon. In addition to his story, the 60-page analysis itself is included. It's important to note at the onset that no project sponsor has been identified. This simply identifies the best five of 12 different possibilities for passenger rail to NYC, Philly and Reading. It is not a feasibility study, despite what it calls itself. That comes later, as the report itself acknowledges (page vii, 4). It is not an alternatives analysis. That, too, would come later. (page vii, 4) There has been no consultation with railroads like Norfolk Southern, which might have problems sharing limited rail space for much-needed freight that minimizes highway traffic. (page 4)
According to the study, 30,000 people commute from the LV to the Newark/NYC area; 100,000 to Philly; and 70,000 to the Reading area. Before getting into the prohibitive costs, the commuting time alone should be a deal killer. It will take 2.5 hours to get to NYC, nearly 2 hours to get to Philly and nearly an hour to Reading. Who is going to spend 5 hours a day sitting in a train?
And will it be 5 hours or more? I took an Amtrak from DC to Pittsburgh two summers ago. The trip was supposed to take 7 hours. It took 12.
My own view is that this analysis is flawed. In addition to identifying routes for Amtrak (the only possible sponsor), feasibility and alternatives should have been explored in detail. For example, the routes into Philly would require the elimination of Bethlehem's Greenway and the Saucon Rail Trail. Not only is this controversial to recreational cyclists and businesses who benefit from them, but it destroys a pedestrian route used by many who work at the casino. It destroys or interferes with several parks and pay $739 million to do so.
And why not identify alternatives first?
As John Marquette observes at Reddit, there are positives to passenger rail. But can't we consider buses?
“Four or five express buses a day from either Trexlertown P&R or the Lehigh Valley service area on the NE Extension (yes buses have stopped there in the past) to Norristown Transportation Center. Two ways to Philly from there - train or light rail to El. 50-min to 1-hr trip time.
" LANTA can design it and contract out the service to Trans-Bridge (avoids complaints from private sector). Fares can be lower per mile than to NYC. Best part: it could start a lot faster than 12-14 years from now.
"Hidden bonus to this if the senior citizen fare was same as on LANta and SEPTA - nothing. The lottery would help subsidize the service for everybody by getting boomers out of the house for day trips.”
UPDATED 10:15. Below is the perspective of Lehigh County Comm'r Ron Beitler:
Let me start by saying I'd LOVE train service to NYC or Philly and would use it if it made sense to do so. Crazy we don't have it, given our location between major metros. Hindsite it should have never been abandoned back in the 60's.
𝐇𝐎𝐖𝐄𝐕𝐄𝐑, committing county dollars to more studies gives me pause for several reasons:
• The cost is astronomical, not profitable, and would demand massive taxpayer subsidies. While most transit is subsidized, the cost for rail would exceed typical amounts. Estimates are over $800 million.
• Rail wouldn't be competitive with current bus service. Rail to NYC might take an hour longer and service to Philadelphia 2 hours. I can drive to Citizens Bank Park in an hour and 15 minutes, longer with traffic.
• The availability of freight lines is uncertain. And further, whether those times would be convenient is a question.
• In a time when residents overwhelmingly want the region to better manage growth, rail lines would once again supercharge it. Much like happened when I-78 was built. We have to think long and hard about what kind of community we want to be in 20 years and rail service would greatly impact that.
Given these considerations— staggering cost, need for massive subsidies, less than competitive travel times and uncertainty around the availability of freight lines for passenger use—it's clear why I'm hesitant about investing in additional county money to explore passenger rail service.
Challenges are massive and warrant a cautious approach before committing more tax dollars. I'm open to more discussion. But at this point I'm not anywhere close to committing county dollars towards a half million dollar study to move the ball forward.
Gotta say, it's a bummer. Again, LOVE to see passenger rail service here. Just don't know that it's feasible. I've written on my blog before that the viability of American passenger rail depends on achieving true high speeds. Unfortunately, with the exception of Acela that hasn't happened in the US. What's proposed for Lehigh valley service isn't anywhere close to what's needed to make a system work.
𝐖𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐝𝐨 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐤?
When the two Counties (Northampton and Lehigh) considered picking up the option of rail service to Philadelphia, the cost for the amount of users was ridiculous. Septa wanted an outrageous price for providing the service and both Counties voted NO. The rails were torn out and the land donated to the communities for a rail to trail system for bikers, joggers, exerciser's, etc. to enjoy. The Counties said it was cheaper to buy everyone utilizing the Philadelphia service a Cadillac car rather than paying what Septa wanted to provide the service. It is good we revisit this issue but let's not get nutsy about it.
ReplyDeleteThe rail study is pure fiction. For example, one route to NYC would be via NJTransit tracks which currently terminate in High Bridge. I know his route as I lived in High Bridge for awhile and made frequent trips to NYC. But, I never took the High Bridge train. I would drive to Summit to catch an express train.
ReplyDeleteAt present, the High Bridge NJTransit route does not go directly to Penn Station in NYC, but to Penn Station in Newark. Currently, that train makes 16 stops between High Bridge and Newark and takes 90 minutes off-peak. To get to NYC, riders then have to transfer to another train or take the PATH.
However, the study fantasizes that for riders from the Lehigh Valley, NJTransit would allow Lehigh Valley express trains via High Bridge that go directly to Penn Station in NYC while only making 5 stops. Yeah, right. That would be pure economic suicide for the State of New Jersey - making it as fast or faster to get to NYC from Allentown as it currently takes to get from High Bridge to NYC.
Well written. It's a ridiculous idea, however. Remember, we're broke.
ReplyDeleteHeard Mcclue in his never-ending quest for votes claim to have pushed to have this study done to get trains. Please stop deceiving people. Ny or Phila trains are gone, and they are not coming back. Be honest and tell the truth. Stop perpetuating this romantic fantasy. The tracks were ripped up for trails and the costs are prohibitive. The same with a LV commuter train. Take some of that money and invest it in a real functional valley publics transit system like th buses.
ReplyDeleteLocal transit is a mess. LANTA is backward and not very flexible. Also, the mad rush to fill developer's pockets with thousands of apartments is staining our already over stressed infrastructure. The Lehigh Valley is now and will be more of a dingy overpriced transient bedroom community for NY and NJ.
Wake up people. These politicians are lying while they line their coffers with developer cash.
This survey is not worth the paper it was printed on. Anybody who follows the railroad industry both locally and nationally knows that there is zero chance of passenger rail out of the Lehigh Valley. The same can be said for proposed passenger rail between Scranton and NYC. Dream on. It is NOT going to happen.
ReplyDeletePeople transfers on rails simply “don’t pay the freight”! Commuters that have moved to lower tax venues and now looking for subsidies. The evolution in transportation as result of byway development promoted tax migration and bus transportation back to venues that demand more pay, so they pick up the margin . Remember, it’s not what you make $ , it’s what you keep!
ReplyDeleteUtterly stupid idea and a total waste of money spent for a small portion of the population. This money could be used to fix PA's terrible roads.
ReplyDeleteI like trains and I've traveled through Europe many times. I'm stumped when trying to think of a single thing our government has made more affordable and efficient. Our government's current train set is one of the most stunningly inefficient enterprises in American life. This study is just the beginning of this project's waste and inefficiency. Stop with this crap. We're tapped out from spending money on wars, like Bernie's favorite one in Ukraine. Where's your latest cheerleading post on that? Trains???
ReplyDeleteThis was not a serious study. It lacks detail, impact of future growth and evolution of commuting patterns, and seems to fail at meeting the basic criteria needed to be accepted into Amtrak’s proposed expansion plan (largely funded by the federal government). It’s embarrassing Scranton and Reading are ahead of us.
ReplyDeleteThis is a failure. It is time for Becky Bradley to go.
6:25 AM. It’s a Penndot study stated by them at the meeting. Penndot’s consultant said it is a first step required by the feds. They also said it is the same type of required study that they did for Reading. It has nothing to do with Bradley.
DeleteThere’s only a handful of people who could be going on like broken record about Bradley over the last few years.
DeleteMaybe it’s time for some 20th century thinking. Let get some new rails that support high speed trains like they have in European countries and Japan.
ReplyDeleteThe evolution of high-speed rail has reshaped the transport landscape by offering an alternative to aviation, promoting economic growth, reducing travel times and offering a greener alternative.
Business's and the wealthy will have to pay their fair share of taxes so that we can build this much needed transportation system for our country.
What wrong with getting from point A to point B at 250-300 MPH?
Mike McFadden
ReplyDeleteFundamental error “If we build it, people will come”. May work in movie land, but not real world. One has to identify the specific, potential user. And, ask that user if they will use the service considering time and potential price levels. (Costs are dependent on continuing government support.) To suggest that 30,000 people commute daily to the NYC/Newark area means nothing. Depending on definition, Clinton, NJ is located in that area as well as fourteen NJ counties. My problem with this entire exercise is the fact that it is being driven by myths and misinformation. The most disturbing myth is the belief that a commuter train will significantly reduce traffic on I 78. No empirical evidence to back that claim while NJ Transit surveys of commuters showed little auto traffic actually going to Manhattan. The best alternative is bus service to a major junction where access to rail can be obtained. For example, Metropark, NJ, one hour away, would give access to NJ Transit and Amtrak. (Or, have you seen the SEPTA facility at Cornwall Heights) NJ Transit did consider a study to construct such a facility in Western NJ but stopped when Lehigh Valley interests pushed commuter services. We have a transportation authority. There is no need to reinvent the wheel. Bus the commuter to the train station.
Groundhog Day …..again.
ReplyDeleteThis review, analysis, or whatever its name will not happen. Over the years, this rail line idea has been exploited for producing income to those that are commissioned to do studies, graphs, charts, and anything else to get hopes up , knowing full well it is not even remotely close to happening. Apologize for my honest opinion.
The people who commute to North NJ/NYC or Philadelphia should live in North NJ/NYC or Philadelphia. If they want the benefits of earning more money, then they shouldn't benefit from the LV's lower cost of living. They do nothing but add congestion and increase the costs of living for those who live here because we work here. We don't need rail. We need the long commuters to go back where they belong.
ReplyDeleteA little sour about your life?
DeleteHonesty is hard to take if you’re not used to it.
DeleteI believe you have sponsor & operator confused and I don't believe the operator would be Amtrak as the proposed possible routes connect to NJT & SEPTA routes for final destination with no direct connection with the broader Amtrak network. Also, I imagine the proponents of rail might not want a SH%T ton of additional development in the Lehigh Valley, because that would be a HUGE negative to consider or maybe I should say YUUUGE as the influx of people would pronounce it.
ReplyDeleteIt’s a great study. I wish I could have worked on it. It’s a great dream project, but it’s just that- a dream. I find the estimated number of commuters greatly exaggerated and the problem that is not mentioned is that these commuters are not going to one central location. We are suburbanized, like it or not. I’d love to take a train when going into NYC, even if it takes longer. I hate the drive. The LV had a great bus system before the new owners of Bieber decided to run it into the ground. Door to door, Hellertown to Port Authority with no stops. Trans-bridge isn’t the same, too many stops. And if it was reliably profitable there would be more bus line competition. The LV gave up train service decades ago- residents just didn’t use it. And where would a station be? Downtown? Parking? Suburban? It was a fun idea folks.
ReplyDelete"What wrong with getting from point A to point B at 250-300 MPH?"
ReplyDeleteType the following into your browser: california high speed rail project
You'll have to sort through some of the cheerleading, but the key phrase "another 100 billion dollars" keeps popping up.
Agreed. I don't get these constant attacks on LVPC. They are not building the warehouses or advocating for rail.
ReplyDeleteIn a longer conversation with someone, I offered this atop the earlier quote from Reddit (tanks, Bernie, for the shoutout!):
ReplyDeleteI’d also encourage LANta to encourage our legislators to a proposed SEPTA expansion from the Doylestown line to Lansdale up to Shelly/Quakertown (the current end of the rail trail) and NJTransit back to Phillipsburg from the current High Bridge station on the Raritan Valley line.
Additionally, Trans-Bridge isn’t happy with the proposed rail plan (today, WFMZ). Solution: help them set up an operating subsidiary to operate the rail line. The bus isn’t competition, as I’ve asserted in the past. The bus is faster unless you’re going beyond Penn Station (or coming here as a student or business person). Then the train is desirable. The bus is cheaper now and always will be. Trains generally offer more comfort at a premium fare.
Two stations in the Valley: Glendon for Bethlehem and Easton (I-78 adjacency) and Allentown West near 78 at Lehigh Street. Both locations can offer parking and highway access. Our potential rail passengers want what the LVIA intermodal bus terminal does: a kind of central regional place and parking. Maybe traffic to the casino would support a station too. Fewer stops mean faster service.
A note about the Scranton line: a rail authority owns the PA trackage and the state of NJ has the line from Dover northwest to the river. That NJ stretch was designed for fast trains and is largely intact (and so big that the earthworks are visible from space). This project has a lot of backers (as does the Reading, PA service to Philadelphia) and is likely to happen.
I think we don’t get as many nice things as other areas because of our Quaker heritage of government (decision-making at smallest, most local level possible and the Pennsylvania German qualities of thrift (think: scrapple) and resistance to change
(buggies). Sometimes that serves the region well. Other times, like when we have a massive influx of people from elsewhere, the existing system is overwhelmed. This is a good place to live, just…difficult…sometimes.
Bingo… with the exception of where the stations should be. The train will bring growth, particularly from the NYC area - the financial capital of the world. If we want an injection of drivers and sprawl your proposed station locations will do the trick. If we want to channel the growth into our cities stations close to the historic locations of the legacy stations will facilitate it. Over the next 30 years development patterns in the region will look a whole lot different, and healthier to be perfectly honest.
DeleteBernie, I wrote the following back in 2007. It is still valid. "Back on December 6, 2007, I was invited to attend a meeting at the Rayburn House Office Building in Washington DC with U.S. Rep. Charlie Dent, a member of the House Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure, in which he hosted several transportation and municipal officials from the Lehigh Valley region and experts from the Federal Transit Administration (FTA). The purpose of the event was to discuss the steps required to secure federal support for the development of passenger rail service in the Lehigh Valley region. FTA officials provided information on the federal New Starts and Small Starts programs, which would be used to help re-establish passenger rail service in the region. U.S. Sen. Arlen Specter and U.S. Rep. Allyson Schwartz were also in attendance. The meeting focused on two initiatives: commuter rail connecting the Lehigh Valley to New Jersey Transit in Highbridge, New Jersey; and commuter rail connecting Lansdale with Quakertown and eventually to Shelly on the Bucks/Lehigh County line. Congressman Dent noted that currently 23 passenger rail projects across the country receive government support through the Federal Transit Administration’s (FTA) New Starts program. Additionally, the FTA is tracking roughly 100 major transit initiatives currently in the earliest stages of planning. FTA officials stressed that steps taken by a community to receive New Starts or Small Starts support must include analyzing possible transit alternatives, such as enhanced bus service and expanded park-and-ride. I left that meeting with a sense that Washington was going to give the big bucks to the big metropolitan cities. It appeared that the FTA was selling the Small Starts program to the Lehigh Valley contingent. This would just enhance the current infrastructure of bus service to NYC and Philadelphia. That was just my gut feeling. I would be delighted to see passenger rail service to NYC or Philadelphia, but that will never happen anytime soon. For now, any Federal funding for passenger rail service in the Lehigh Valley is dead. The way the FTA explained it, the Lehigh Valley would be competing against other metropolitan statistical areas across the United States for very limited funding. The LV is ranked 62nd among MSA's. We cannot compete against the big cities, no matter how good a study the LV drafts. Over 330 projects have been submitted across the United States for federal funding of this type. Very few are rewarded. Are we kidding ourselves here? The FTA kept telling the Lehigh Valley contingent (by a wink-wink, nod-nod) that it would be better going after the Small Starts program which would entail looking at the bus corridors, rather than rail."
ReplyDeleteBill Hillanbrand
10:36
ReplyDeleteThat would be a good use of the $1.8 trillion the US collects in revenue, and more if everyone would pay their fair share.
4:15. Let's see, 100 billion guzinto 1.8 trillion 18 times. Gosh, we could build 18 high speed lines form Los Angeles to San Francisco or the equivalent! All the other government spending would have to come from "somebody else's fair share." And that's assuming the 100 billion would be enough. (Original estimate was 35 billion.)
DeleteChanges to Port Authority Bus Terminal; quoting Gothamist (web publication of WNYC News), Feb 1, 2024:
ReplyDelete“The project will cost an estimated $10 billion and take at least eight years to complete, officials said. The work would require the demolition of the current bus terminal — and the construction of a temporary facility for bus riders to board while the new building is erected.
“Cotton warned there would be “significant” traffic disruptions in Midtown while construction is underway. But he said the agency’s “process for dealing with traffic management has become enormously sophisticated” due to its recent reconstruction of LaGuardia Airport.”
Redundancy is a good thing sometimes. Note they’re going to pay for some of it with the $15 congestion charge, which is intended to improve transportation. A New York decision.
These numbers sound like something from the research from the NIZ. I live in an upper-middle class neighborhood in a local township, houses sell for $500-$700K. I have friends who live in west end Allentown. How come I don’t know any of these commuters who go to NYC or Philly daily for their high-paying jobs. Because they don’t exist. The Pandemic changed things but there weren’t that many commuters beforehand. We’d love to have train service, but with a bus fare at $60. one-way—what would a train fare be? And of course we want free parking.
ReplyDeleteI hate when people rip a bandaid off of an old wound. We traveled this road years ago, ending in a high priced review and no results. Unless this new crew of believers has a magic ball and billions in funding, it is already under water.
ReplyDeleteMy better half just took the bus from ABE Airport to PABT today to visit family. 2:25 minutes scheduled trip time, 2:40 minutes actual.
ReplyDeleteIn Reading the Schuylkill River Passenger Rail Authority was formed to sponsor the initiative to take advantage of federal funding and bring Amtrak service to Reading. They have the authority to negotiate and sign agreements in the best interest of multiple parties across jurisdictions as the conversation advances. An absolute necessity to get an endeavor like this done.
ReplyDeleteIn the Lehigh Valley we shouldn’t need to form an authority to do this because we have the Lehigh Valley Planning Commission. Why aren’t they stepping up on this one? It’s an actual opportunity for them to get something significant done for the region rather than talk and procure studies all day.
The Lehigh Valley will never support a Triple A baseball team.
ReplyDeleteWe live on a desert island when it comes to the ability to get to any trains. As I get older, I would no longer attempt to drive to New York City and really hate to drive to Philadelphia due to the inevtable congestion and traffic delays. Buses get stuck in the same congesgtion on the roads. Buses are crampy, smelly and subject to traffic delays. Trains are much more comfortable and civilized.
ReplyDeleteWhy is it that the rest of the world can have modern, efficient, climate friendly train service and we are always stuck in the same negativity here in the LV?
11:10
ReplyDeleteIt’s worth the price to have valid transportation to get around this country, hit all the main hubs throughout the country.
As much as I love the idea of train travel, its not practical in America, and that's fine. We are a suburban nation, for better or worse we are far different from Europe and that's OK. The challenge to trains in the US is that most trips start and end in suburban places. Those who romanticize about train trips to Philly, should take SEPTA from Doylestown to Allentown. While its inexpensive ($16 round trip), the ride is excruciatingly long (up to 1.5 hours). Ive also been on that Amtrack service to Pittsburgh, wishing I'd just rented a car (much quicker, cheaper & convenient) I'm in favor of adding dedicated bus lanes to I-78 with direct nonstop service to New York.
ReplyDeleteI understand that LVPC/LVTS was not allowed to internally comment on the report before it was publicly released, which is unusual because they are the transportation planning organization for the Lehigh Valley. The scope of the study should have been more limited. Going to Phila. via Reading is not practical because of the time (as Bernie noted) and the lack of demand between the Lehigh Valley and Center City Reading.
ReplyDeleteRipping up the Saucon Valley rail trail for new rail lines is not practical (although there is such a thing as "rail with trail," but that is usually involving adding a trail to excess land along an existing rail line).
Another alternative is dedicated bus improvements to get around bottlenecks.
As noted above, some alternatives to NYC rely upon the PATH train. The PATH train from Newark into Manhattan is cheap, but it has been identified in a study as the slowest transit line in the northeast.
ReplyDeleteLVPC should not be blamed for this study - they had not control over it.
It is amazing that a study was done without talking to the owners of the rail corridors. In particular, Norfolk Southern has stressed that their east-west freight rail lines are extremely busy and relatively high speed and involve very large numbers of rail cars. In addition to scheduling problems, there also safety issues in combining frequent freight service with passenger service. Every type of hazardous and toxic material is carried on rail cars, and their safety record is getting worse.
I've sat an hour on an Amtrak line in Indiana waiting behind freight rail going 10 mph, on the way to Chicago. If another parallel rail line is needed for passenger rail, that is not only expensive, but may need additional width of land.
One reason why passenger rail service is practical along much of the northeast corridor is that in many cases Amtrak owns their own rail right-of-way.
LVPC should be stepping up as the owner of this process to make sure we are at the top of Amtrak’s list of candidate cities for expanded rail service. Someone is going to receive this funding - why not us? We are late but it’s not too late.
DeleteThe Path from Newark to WTC is super easy, four quick stops on the way and a $3.25 fare. Let’s get this service established and we can focus on improving it over time.
That’s why we have eminent domain. American taxpayer’s paid for the railways and they should have a way to build new systems that are more economical than flying around this country. Let’s build high speed trains for this great country and get rid of the old way of thinking like buses and cars for transportation.
ReplyDeleteFirst we must get everyone to start paying in their fair share of taxes to help offset the cost of high speed railways. Secondly, we could start a national campaign to hire people within our country to build, design, and manufacture the trains and infrastructure.
Lastly, we need thinker of tomorrow to make this happen and it is possible.
We have lost our minds to even consider wasting enormous amounts of money on a rail service that would be barely utilized while our road and bridge infrastructure ages and deteriorates due to lack of funding. Time to prioritize widening 22 to 6 lanes (that highway is a congested embarrassment), improving the roads around bath and Nazareth and 309 in lehigh, rebuild the hill to hill bridge in my home town, and fixing all the bridges in the region. These are the things that matter to LV citizens. In all these elaborate plans we forget about the people that actually freaking live here. Rail to NYC just cedes our community to the megapolis.
ReplyDeleteWe dump tons of money into ABE airport and you can’t even get anywhere (for a reasonable price, ant a reasonable time) outside of a handful of Florida retirement destinations. 22 is not very congested. If you think so you don’t get out much.
DeleteAccess to NYC would enable valley residents to commute 2-3 days a week to earn a decent wage ($150k plus). Our salaries and opportunities to start knowledge business really lack here. We are falling behind. The warehouses are a clear sign of our lack of progress.
Anonymous 11:33:
ReplyDeleteNo. People should live where they work; save a few exceptions like airline pilot, CDL, et al. Stop wasting fuel just because you can afford to.
You act like everyone shows up at the plant and punches a clock for 8 hours. The nature of work has changed. People may work in NY two days, DC another, and from home another day and a half.
DeleteVery interesting comments. I wonder if the people getting excited about riding a train to NYC a couple times a year for fun fully realize the possible impact of this kind of train service on the Lehigh Valley. My guess is that Lehigh Valley rail access will cause even more people from the New York metro to migrate here, driving up housing costs even more and reducing the quality of life in the region.
ReplyDeleteNo, the rail proponents do not understand or perhaps do not care that this proposed nyc connection brings another 100k+ nyc folks here and doubles the cost of housing, in effect pricing the rest of the LV natives out of the housing and rental market. It is more important to the clueless wannabe local elites to make this place an extension of nyc. I personally will vote against any politician in either party who supports this rail nonsense. Our tax dollars must go to our own people, and not to make it easier for nyc/nj citizens to escape the inflationary disaster of their own making.
DeleteTake their projected time frame and budget estimates and quadruple them. And when talking about commuters to NYC let's not forget to add the 15-30-minute commute to the local train station parking lot (free?), and arriving early to avoid missing that nearly three-hour train trip to the continually rotting Apple. Not mentioned much above is the need to change from the LV diesel train to an electric one to go under the Hudson. A better idea might be to bring those NY jobs to the Valley. Commuters would be going against the flow. Put the forklifts away and make room for some evil white-collar guys. :)
ReplyDeleteFinally, shouldn't PennDOT be investing in 'local' transportation, rather than inter-state 'studies'? I believe that in spite of much-bragged-about growth in LV population, that Lanta still have about the same number of buses for years.
The population of this region (Lehigh & Northampton) is currently around 685,000. Whether we like it or not, by the year 2050 the population of the Lehigh Valley will be 800,000, eclipsing the 1,000,000 mark somewhere in the last quarter of the century.
ReplyDeleteStatistically, most of our children, but certainly the majority of our grandchildren and great grandchildren will be part of that million.
If your birth year begins with a "19" its not really your place for an opinion on rail service needs for this area. You won't be using it.
I see. Old people do not count.
ReplyDeleteThe comment was stated perfectly well but its basis is valid.
DeleteIn 30 years all the Boomers will be gone. Millennials will be grandparents. This would be an investment in the future.
*wasn’t stated perfectly well
Delete"If your birth year begins with a "19" its not really your place for an opinion on rail service needs for this area. You won't be using it."
ReplyDeleteno, but my tax dollars will be helping fund it. So that gives me a right to an opinion, asshat.
You have a right to an opinion, but it is unfortunately limited. I'm sure you appreciate that your grandfather didn't have the same opinion and arrogance as you when Social Security or the National Highway systems were funded.
ReplyDeleteJust more government money pits! If it was close to feasible, private sector would jump on it. Instead it will just be an extension of Amtrak, which may be the biggest money pit over the long term. They lose money on $14 cheeseburgers and $3 cans of soda. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg! It’s now an ingrained cost, that isn’t even mentioned. Government has zero ability to do anything even close to private sector, yet they constantly give each other awards and can’t avoid patting themselves on the back, no matter how inept and incompetent they are. Wonder how much this study cost?
ReplyDeleteIn the past, the way funding was structured, if the Lehigh Valley wanted rail service, they would have had to divert funding from LANTA.
ReplyDeleteThere is new federal funding, but that will only cover a few projects across the country that can show very high cost-benefit analysis.
The most cost-efficient passenger rail options may be to seek that NJ Transit provide service to Phillipsburg, and then buses from the Lehigh Valley could connect to it. There would be much more demand for commuter rail service from Phillipsburg to NYC than from Allentown to NYC.
Likewise, if SEPTA could extend passenger rail north to Quakertown, there could be efficient bus service to connect to it. There would be much more demand for daily commuter rail service from Quakertown to Phila. than from Allentown to Phila.
You can't make passenger rail service work financially with occasional trips by tourists. You need daily service. SEPTA's existing passenger rail service has seen big decreases in ridership on Mondays and Fridays, because many people are working a hybrid schedule.
Finally, some sanity about passenger rail service in the Lehigh Valley. IMHO, the only viable option is extending the former Central RR of New Jersey (now New Jersey Transit) line from High Bridge westward. The tracks are still in and somewhat maintained between High Bridge and Bloomsbury. There is a junction still in place at Bloomsbury with the Norfolk Southern freight line. From there. it's an under seven-mile jaunt to P-burg, which could be the furthest west the train goes. They'd have to make arrangement with NS for trackage rights (which considering the bad press and public outcry NS has experienced lately, they might be looking for a win) and then build a station in P-burg. Interstingly enough this service was cut in the mid 1960's and then brought back in the mid-70's by the Central. It lasted about five years, I believe. Even this idea is an almost-impossible long-shot and does nothing about the other obstacles in place of passenger rail. It's a huge waste of taxpayer dollars to spend any more on "studies" that do nothing except line the pockets of a few well-connected consultants.
ReplyDelete