On March 30, 2019, Chinese national Yujing Zhang was apprehended somewhere inside then President Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago compund. She was carrying two passports, four cellphones, a laptop, a hard drive and a thumb drive at the time of her arrest. That's hardly what I'd expect to see on a Trump fan or tourist. It is what I'd expect to see on a spy. As Politico reported way back in 2017, Trump's Florida White House was heaven for foreign adversaries who wanted to eavesdrop on the President and his inner circle. And this was reported long before it became known that Trump was keeping highly sensitive information there, like the kind that could get our agents killed. This is why the most important task right now is to determine what damage, if any, has been done to our national security. It's actually far more important than deciding whether to charge Trump. If a national security assessment reveals that our secrets were compromised, or that foreign assets were killed, that should inform any criminal assessment.
As regular readers of this blog are aware, I consider Trump a danger to democracy. But I'm sick of him and the phony patriots who cling to his every word. The fact that he kept some of these records in a desk drawer of his own office, mixed with expired passports, indicates to me that he acted willfully. But even I doubt that Trump would intentionally compromise our national security. Absent very clear evidence that he did so, I doubt he will be charged for just being the pain in the ass that he's always been.
This Country must make sure that this lunatic may never hold public office again. Whatever it takes to do that must be done. Assassination is not an option. Everything else must be on the table. He is a danger to our country and our democracy.
ReplyDeleteI can respect people who saw Trump as representing their fears and hopes for the future. I know good people who fear our great nation is off course. However, Trump himself is not only incompetent but also dangerous. We have had incompetent presidents but Trump's lack of knowledge of history and governing is inexcusable. Sorry but the man is an idiot.
ReplyDeleteYou are Sicking And stupid.
ReplyDeletePlease define "Sicking."
DeleteCNN legal guy was describing what looked like documents spread around Trumps office ,marked 2A. That not what his office decor looks like .
ReplyDeleteIt's not. It wasn't. Hillary's closet server was hacked six times. If hers wasn't a nat sec compromise, nothing is. Move on. Meanwhile, the NYT is reporting the FBI staged photos from Mar A Lago. Again, this is banana republic shit. Time to fire and jail FBI agents and try to move the country forward. James Comey should be publicly executed after being publicly tortured after the damage he's done to all of us.
ReplyDeleteIf you consider Trump a danger fo democracy, does your clear thinking thought process consider Biden a breath of fresh air, rainbows, and unicorns? Asking as a white nationalist, MAGA Nazi...
ReplyDeleteLock him up! Lock him up!
ReplyDeleteMaybe. But the statutes at issue in the documents case are more similar to a narcotics drug case than a bank fraud or obstruction of justice case. Top Secret classified documents are a lot like narcotics from a criminal law perspective. You really don’t want to possess them if you are not authorized to do so. If you take Top Secret classified documents from a government facility and store them at your home, you’re guilty. ‘Intent’ may not be as important here.
ReplyDeleteImportant words "real evidence." Their significance can be missed until you are the one under scrutiny.
ReplyDeleteThere is no bigger disaster to this country than old Joe and his lib sycophants. It's always someone else's fault with you dems. You excel at creating disasters, blaming others, then creating a government "fix" that just makes things worse. Then repeat. Right. Trump and his followers are the problem.
ReplyDeleteIt's someone else's fault
DeleteTrump said that everyday for 4 years ,and still says.
What records?, will we ever see what these records were, No, it is all too secret, Just keep soaking up the latest in trump evil propaganda. There likely will not be an indictment, it is all about hoping it saves democrats in the upcoming election.
ReplyDeleteA big distraction from the immanent demise of the country by the failed leadership of the democrat majority.
Just keep shoveling the bullshit. eventually you can't spin no energy, no food, no law and order. Then of course you can blame it on Trump and Putin.
Bernie, do you really believe all this?
The "immanant" demise of our country is lack of proper education.
DeleteWith the exception of the criminally insane puppets who still donate to him, none of us real republicans still think trump is good for the GOP. The egotistical, whining child just has too much baggage. My personal opinion is that he puts suckering people out of money and stoking his ego long before his concern for our nation.
ReplyDeleteShould he go to jail? Has our nations security been compromised? I'm not qualified to say. I am qualified to say the I have no trust in any word he says or action that he takes. I would not vote for him to be deputy animal control officer.
We have real men in the GOP that we should be supporting other than this con man.
The Democrats are acting in desperation to eliminate Trump as a candidate in 2024. There is no other way to describe it. Until 2024, the Democrat goal is to disqualify Trump by some legal ruling or, at least, to dirty him up so much that most people opt not to vote for him even if his name is on the ballot. So far, the “dirty him up” efforts have failed and he hasn’t lost any ground as the lead choice to be the Republican candidate.
ReplyDeleteAs a result of Trump’s popularity, it is my opinion Trump WILL be indicted. It will take months to put together, but a trial before jury will be conducted. In the end, Trump will be cleared of all charges, I believe.
these were declassified before he left office which the president has the lose authority per Judge Amy Berman Jackson. But you are a lawyer so I am sure you are familiar with the Bill Clinton case and will post that very soon. Lastly, I know who did compromise and you voted for her. Again, Left leaning source
ReplyDeletehttps://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/hillary-clinton-emails-2016-server-state-department-fbi-214307/
"It's not. It wasn't. Hillary's closet server was hacked six times. If hers wasn't a nat sec compromise, nothing is"
ReplyDeleteThe "what about" defense might work on social media, but it is irrelevant in a courtroom.
What she did was incredibly stupid. 100 emails contained information that should have been deemed classified at the time they were sent, including 65 emails deemed "Secret" and 22 deemed "Top Secret". An additional 2,093 emails were retroactively designated confidential by the State Department. Clinton denied having such emails, but they were found by investigators. She turned over 30,000 emails and deleted another 30,000 that were personal in nature. Then she denied knowing these matters were classified.
It is known that Russians successful hacked the Clinton campaign. It is known that foreign adversaries attempted to hack her private account. It is unclear to me whether they succeeded.
Without question, Clinton exercised manifestly poor judgment, but the markings on the emails are less clear than they are on hard copies. So she may have acted unintentionally. This argument is supported by emails from her indicating they need to switch to different servers when sensitive topics arose.
So despite cries of "Lock her up," Clinton was never prosecuted. It would be difficult to prove she acted willfully, She did pay a political price. She lost an election.
In contrast to Clinton, there can be no dispute about whether Trump knew he was holding sensitive documents. They are hard copies and clearly marked as such at the top and bottom of ever page.
Clinton cooperated with investigators. It is clear now that Trump did not.
Both Trump and Clinton endangered national security and were very negligent. But I doubt either acted willfully.
The important consideration is assessing damage to national security, not criminal action.
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/18/mueller-clinton-arizona-hack/
https://www.politifact.com/article/2022/aug/09/comparing-hillary-clintons-emails-and-donald-trump/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton_email_controversy#Hacking_attempts
It makes no difference whether these were declassified, but the fact of the matter is they were not.
ReplyDeleteTrump’s arrogance hides a bigger problem, that is that he still doesn’t understand the consequences of his actions. As most rich baby-men, someone has always cleaned us his mess. Sadly he’s not even smart enough to see that his selfish, careless actions could cause deaths, (How many people died on January 6th?) or be a national security concern. And he has no empathy, nor the ability to reflect on his actions. Somewhere, somehow, I suspect that more than one advisor told him these documents were not his to keep, but baby-man said, “mine, mine, mine” and took them anyway. He won’t leave until the GOP scrapes him off because grafting money from the willing public and the RNC Is the family business now. This is money that could be helping qualified, electable Republican candidates win, rather than paying Trump’s defense lawyers.
ReplyDeleteIt continues to amaze me time and time and time again how Trump appeals to the lowest common denominator of uneducated worthless gullible tools.
ReplyDeleteReally, there are very little FACTS anywhere today, everything is political propaganda, If you still believe in the FBI, The state department, the CIA, you are really very insecure and just cant face the reality that this government is corrupt from top to bottom.
ReplyDeleteCan we fix it, not likely, This country is now on the verge of economic and social collapse.
Hopefully several generations from now, after decades of suffering, they can reignite the enthusiasm for a free country.
There is a reason lawyers tell their clients not to say anything. Trump is undermining his own defense. He’s said that he watched the whole raid on his security cameras and also said that the documents were planted and also said that the documents were his but declassified. So which is it?
ReplyDeleteI had a clearance back in the day. When a document is declassified, there is a whole process for that for every individual document (not a “standing order”) and after being declassified the documents are stamped. A good example is here https://gclibrary.commons.gc.cuny.edu/files/2014/07/DDRS1.png
ReplyDeleteI go around my neighborhood and steal things from people's garages at night. I've been caught but the police didnt arrest me. They told the neighbors I was just being a pain in the ass.
ReplyDeleteIf ORIGINAL copies of data are stamped “Classified, Top Secret, whatever” directly on the page, that stamp mark REMAINS on the original sheet of paper even if that same sheet of paper was later designated as NO LONGER CLASSIFIED, TOP SECRET, etc. This is also a component of the present discussion.
ReplyDeleteEven if Trump is eventually cleared, to have just been indicted (and probably handcuffed and marched off for effect) the ultimate prosecution loss, if it happens, is not really of concern. It’s the horrible optics that matter.
Then there’s the possibility of the prosecution’s evidence being thrown out as “fruit of the poisonous tree” due to an illegal warrant that authorized the raid in the first place. This entire episode can drag on for years. Thus, why I expect an indictment (and big media circus) to happen soon after mid-terms.
George Carlin was right when he said "People are effing stupid"
ReplyDeleteIf I removed business sensitive or IP documents from my employer when I retired/moved one etc. I would be in legal jeopardy. Not sure where the disconnect is here. He should have just kept the dinner service, or a box of pens.
9/1 poster cannot spell and is obviously an officer in the tRump army of losers.
ReplyDelete8.08
ReplyDelete"these were declassified before he left office"
So what are the titles of these documents?
Why the silence on the info of those documents since they are not top secret anymore?
trump can simply point to the list of documents he declassified and tell DOJ to get lost.
trump can read off the titles at his next maga rally.
trump should recite the contents of those documents so his followers can truly see how badly he is being treated and dare the FBI to arrest him.
The problem with that is trump is guilty and he knows that.
About the only defense he could raise is the stupidity defense.
That might have worked if he returned all the top secret files when ordered to do so by a judge.
Because he played games trump better hope President Biden is in a good mood when he begs for a pardon.
The fact of the matter is the left-wing radical Trump hater are trying again and will fail again in their quest to keep Trump off the ballot because he will expose their lies and all their corruptions which is everything they do.
ReplyDelete"The fact of the matter is the left-wing radical Trump hater are trying again and will fail again in their quest to keep Trump off the ballot because he will expose their lies and all their corruptions which is everything they do."
ReplyDeleteYou have failed with this comment to establish anything other than that you are an ardent follower of the cult of the leader Trump. You vilify the other, whether it is Democrats or law enforcement, but fail to make a single factual observation.
"I go around my neighborhood and steal things from people's garages at night. I've been caught but the police didnt arrest me. They told the neighbors I was just being a pain in the ass."
ReplyDeleteYou miss the point. Prosecutors have to prove intent, even in your example. If you broke into a garage bc you mistakenly believed it was yours, you lack criminal intent. Even if you are charged, the case will be tossed. It is not against the law to be stupid. With respect to Trump, the burden is just as high. He usually does a good job of insulating himself, and it will be difficult to prove he acted willfully. But he is digging a grave for himself with his comments on social media.
"Really, there are very little FACTS anywhere today, everything is political propaganda, "
ReplyDeleteUm, according to Trump defender Alan Dershowitz, there already are sufficient facts to merit an indictment. I agree there's plenty of bias on the left and the right. But facts are facts. There is enough evidence to indict him for violating three federal statutes.
He represented he turned everything over when, in fact, he was keeping classified documents in his own desk. He has bragged about having classified dirt on Macron. It is clear that, despite representations to the contrary, he kept top secret material. But it will be tough to establish intent.
All you "patriots" should be very concerned about the damage this has done to our national security. Hopefully, none. But that should be your major concern.
Seems there is some fallout from trump having sensitive documents
ReplyDeletehttps://uproxx.com/viral/donald-trump-emmanuel-macron-french-president-sex-life-dirt/
"As Rolling Stone reports, item 1a on the list of documents and information seized from Mar-a-Lago is “info re: President of France.” While that’s as detailed as the official FBI list gets,"
"But the magazine said the “mere revelation of [the document’s] existence triggered a trans-Atlantic freakout.”
"And Trump’s prior talk about Macron’s allegedly “naughty” ways that “[not] very many people know” only intensified those concerns. Both French and U.S. officials worked to figure out precisely what Trump had on Macron and France’s government, and if any of it was sensitive in nature, the sources said. The officials in both nations wanted to know if this discovery signified some kind of national-security breach — or if it amounted to a frivolous, but stolen, keepsake."
"what the hell would Trump need with “intelligence” on Emmanuel Macron’s sex life?"
At the least trump cannot keep his mouth shut on sensitive information and seems a little creepy.
The other problem is that when President Biden might need Macron for work on the Ukrainian war he has this crap floating around.
Yep way to go donnie ---you pissed off the French government via your criminal stupidity.
Left-wing radical Trump hater here. The MAGAs clearly believe that they should do whatever they can get away with, so that's going to be my new attitude.
ReplyDelete11.40
ReplyDelete"difficult to prove he acted willfully."
So when a court order demands all the documents returned and you fail to obey the Court it seems you got some "splaining" to do.
Would not the violation of the Court order be a violation in itself?
Unless trump throws his lawyer under the bus and the Court believes that?
Sounds like a risky tactic.
Going to be difficult to prove, Bernie. That is, indicate specifically which document led directly to, and was the sole reason why the incident of damage occurred. Short of that, it’s supposition. Although, we both know, if such a trial is held in D.C. Trump will most definitely lose!
ReplyDeleteIt is a fact the left wing is afraid of Trump becoming our President again and they will once again make up lies and fail for the tenth time and that is fact. Also it is fact that your democratic policies of BIDEN is a complete failure and that is fact.
ReplyDelete"So when a court order demands all the documents returned and you fail to obey the Court it seems you got some "splaining" to do.
ReplyDeleteWould not the violation of the Court order be a violation in itself?
Unless trump throws his lawyer under the bus and the Court believes that?
Sounds like a risky tactic."
First, a subpoena is not a court order.
Second, the misrepresentation that all classified documents have been returned can be intentional. But it could also be a mistake made by the attorney who did the search on behalf of Trump. That is not criminal. Also, it is a misrepresentation made by the attorney, not Trump. Did she do so intentionally? That fails, by itself, to establish intent.
Making out the elements of an offence sufficient to support an indictment can still be insufficient to convict. Prosecutors are not going to file charges unless they have him six ways to Sunday. Maybe they do, but the evidence of record is still insufficient.
"It is a fact the left wing is afraid of Trump becoming our President again and they will once again make up lies and fail for the tenth time and that is fact. Also it is fact that your democratic policies of BIDEN is a complete failure and that is fact."
ReplyDeleteThose are NOT facts. You are making predictions and stating opinions, not facts. Your inability to discern the difference is one reason why you have fallen for the cult of the leader.
We are ALL merely stating opinions. Sheesh!
ReplyDeleteWhy do you doubt that Trump would not compromise our national security? He's never done anything except put himself first.
ReplyDeleteWRONG! He will/does compromise national security because he will do whatever it takes to try and keep the RUSSIA RUSSIA RUSSIA pee tapes from coming out. Unfortunately for him, they WILL surface……..
ReplyDeleteFor the complete MORONS posting here thinking that removing Trump from the 2024 Presidential field is a goal of the Democrats, you are delirious. If anything having Trump on the ticket is a sure fire loss for the GOP and Dems would be tickled to see him there again. He'd get maybe 35% of the vote across the country, basically just the large swath of idiots that believe anything he says and fly flags with his name on it, like the little fan boys they are.
ReplyDeleteWhether he dodges yet another bullet of his own making, Trump will NOT be in the White House or President ever again. Deal with it.
"We are ALL merely stating opinions. Sheesh!"
ReplyDeleteThe arrest of a Chinese national with four cellphones, laptop, thumb drive and hard drive inside the Mar-a-Lago compound is fact.
That Trump had more than 300 classified documents at Mar-a-Lago is fact.
That his attorney misrepresented that all documents had been returned is fact.
That Trump actually kept some classified documents inside his desk is Fact.
That Trump had frequent visitors to his Mar-a-Lago office is fact, according to his own attorney.
That Trump maintained a dossier on the sex life of Emmanuelle Macron is fact.
That Trump bragged about this is fact.
That Trump never went through the process of declassifying these documents is fact.
12.59
ReplyDelete"First, a subpoena is not a court order."
OK--I am not trying to be difficult.
The subpoena has no legal force behind it?
Why would trump even consider it and just ignore it?
I get trump can say that he ordered his attorney to do the job but isn't trump responsible for the job being done?
He would get a pass because the incompetency of the attorney?
The attorney falls on her sword and trump just laughs and walks away?
if you can help me understand what power the subpoena has you have my thanks.
I just want to live a life where I never have to hear the name of TRUMP ever again. The man is not fit to run a five & dime store. If anything he and his family need to go back to the swamp land that brew scum like them. Man what a f…ing nightmare his administration was and we will be paying the price for his incompetence pick for federal judges, Supreme Court justices and unfair tax advantages for his rich friends. That will affect our lives for decade to come. Let the swamp things go back to the swamp.
ReplyDelete"OK--I am not trying to be difficult.
ReplyDeleteThe subpoena has no legal force behind it?
Why would trump even consider it and just ignore it?"
You are being difficult. A subpoena is a writ summoning someone to testify or produce materials. It can be issued by a court but usually comes from a government agency or grand jury. In this instance, it was a Grand Jury, not a court. Of course there is legal force behind subpoenas that are lawfully issued. Next time use a dictionary.
I sincerely hope these are the new rules of engagement. I despise Trump. But I also despise what Biden is doing and look forward to his indictment, which will surely come upon leaving office. Japan and some European countries have been using this battle tactic. It's arrived here. And while the current suspect is from one party, the next suspect will certainly be from the other. I predict both Trump and Biden will eventually be criminally tried. It's a devastating but necessary blow to the unbridled power of the executive branch. One orange circus clown or one kid touching dementia sufferer should not have this much power.
ReplyDeleteYou can't even have a rational discussion with Trump supporters. There's just no logic.
ReplyDeleteTrumpbots: "Hillary had classified documents too"
Logic: Then why didn't Trump lock her up like he promised?
Trumpbots: Comey protected her!!!!!
Logic: Yes, but then Trump fired Comey and hand picked his replacement (who just authorized the Mar-A-Lago raid), why didn't Trump go after Hillary then?"
Trumpbots: something something deep state!
This is so low on the list of things I care about, it's laughable.
ReplyDeleteI'm much more concerned that energy prices remain sky high as we head into winter, food and necessity costs continue to rise, drugs continue to come across our open borders to kill our kids, crime is out-of-control in our major cities, our public schools are failing, and the government keeps needlessly spending to the point that EVERY American now owns about $100,000 of the national debt.
I could go on, but all those are the fault of the democrat party, which is much more of a national security threat to America than a few documents that Trump may or may not have kept.
I think I’m rather rational, I don’t like Trump personally,and have met him at Pocono Race track as we were doing opening in the National Guard. . But- this administration is apparently by “handlers “ that place stuff in front of a President that probably has dementia . The Democratic's think they probably have upper hand now coming into the Midterm, well that’s 10 weeks away , this administration has depleted the strategic oil reserves so much we can’t refuel war ships if we tangle with Chinese.MISTAKE!, . fuel consumption is still down about 6% from before Corona. Prices are dropping currently, but, the EU is going to tell Russian fuel suppler by Dec what the limit will be. I’m predicting that our fuel will increase 20-25% no later than January 1 2023. This WH has put our oil problems back 4-6 years for forecasting already. We need to be ENERGY INDEPENDENT to be safe from foreign costs but also conflict. God Bless America.
ReplyDeleteBernieOHare to Peter, Peter your comment has nothing to do with the topic. Stay on point. Pretend it’s a firing range and aim for the target.
ReplyDelete4.16
ReplyDelete"which is much more of a national security threat to America than a few documents that Trump may or may not have kept."
So your saying that trump can break any law he wants unlike everyone else--Gotcha
The best part is that the Clintons will be running free while Trump is in prison carrying the soap for Big Bubba.
ReplyDeleteI remain a registered Republican but find little in common with MAGA types. I understand many Americans who are sucked in with their view of “personality politics” and tired of a government run amuck with incompetence and political bias.Trump is crazy and his behavior becomes more problematic by the day but the reality is he was elected president. Why ? Because the average citizen is tired of watching our country crumble. They were looking for change in 2016. Hillary or Trump…. What form of corruption would win. Now we have Joe promoting woke agendas and doing an absolutely poor job of governing, from the disgrace of Afghanistan’s exit to our economic implosion. What’s next ? It can’t be a choice between a crazy man and a demented man ! Our Country is in deep trouble, our system of government is no longer working. Is it time for a new revolution. I think not. We need term limits for all elected offices , Federal, State, and Local. “Throw the bums out “ Both Parties. Don’t screw with the Constitution ( it has worked well for the most part for over 200 plus years). We need to calm things down and put an end to the 5 % wackos from the left and right. We need to do something about the media. They are pushing an agenda of hatred. Save for the Civil War political beliefs in our country have been bloodless. Let’s keep it calm and civil. Maybe we need to end the exclusivity of two Parties ( They are both out of control). We need a transparent measured plan for restructuring our forms of governance and systems of election financing. I fear we are moving towards a violent solution that may have “outside” influence. We are Americans first, tolerant of different beliefs and enablers of equality . Let’s stop the slide towards extremism.
ReplyDelete4:16 So the National debt which has been growing since this country started is now a Democratic Problem. Please explain how you are so narrowly minded and selective it to blame it on you choice or are you just spewing some Faux news piece.
ReplyDelete@5:19 you say you are rational but you worship a clown who has called you a loser, a failure, a moron and generally stupid for being in the military. I guess Trump was right about some of those in the when he can kick them in the teeth and they come back to idolize him.
ReplyDeleteA to use another of your orange idols terms you are just pathetic.