Today's one-liner: "The shortest way to the distinguishing excellence of any writer is through his hostile critics." Richard LeGallienne
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Monday, June 02, 2014
Did We Just Swap 5 Jihadists For a Deserter?
That's what CNN is saying. Just when I think the Obama administration can't possibly be more idiotic, it proves me wrong.
62 comments:
You own views are appreciated, especially if they differ from mine. But remember, commenting is a privilege, not a right. I will delete personal attacks or off-topic remarks at my discretion. Comments that play into the tribalism that has consumed this nation will be declined. So will comments alleging voter fraud unless backed up by concrete evidence. If you attack someone personally, I expect you to identify yourself. I will delete criticisms of my comment policy, vulgarities, cut-and-paste jobs from other sources and any suggestion of violence towards anyone. I will also delete sweeping generalizations about mainstream parties or ideologies, i.e. identity politics. My decisions on these matters are made on a case by case basis, and may be affected by my mood that day, my access to the blog at the time the comment was made or other information that isn’t readily apparent.
How many more times do American citizens need to shake their heads? This latest move makes me uneasy, to say the least.
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, CNN can hardly be trusted. I won't even go there for perspective any more. Second, our population has changed so as to allow curiosities like this to go unchallenged.
Our Congress and Senate is failing us! Evidently, most of our reps are gutless, political prostitutes. They 'got theirs,' so let's not anyone make waves.
Call you local Washington rep's office. If you are fortunate enough to get anything but a recording, just say
"Knock, Knock. Anybody home"?
Fred Windish
Ohare: no
ReplyDeleteDid Reagan negotiate with terrorist when he undermined Carters efforts to free Americans held in Iran?
ReplyDeleteHow many Reagan officials were indicted in the Iran Contra arms for hostages deal. What actually happened to those arms?
Did W negotiations with Quadafi dispute Libya's involvement in Pan Am over Scotland?
Is Snowden a hero or deserter?
I think I will wait for an official determination from the military before casting judgement. Seems odd that he would be given a promotion while held captive if he was a deserter.
Seems odd that his fellow soldiers would call him a deserter if it were not so. That has more credibility to me and any vet than what brass in D.C. Decide.
ReplyDeleteGot news for ya 904 am, you are currently paying the price for electing the most incompetent worthless liar republican president in our history. Do you think for one minute that our current chief would have been elected had W done a decent job. No wonder republicans cant inspire the nation. It doesnt matter what happens till 2016 republicans have no chance in 2016 with its current lineup.
ReplyDeleteEnough with the Obama hate. Our soldier is coming home. mOst of the nuts at the base our of no further use anyway. Get over it people.
ReplyDeletePosters 9:58 and 11:09 -
ReplyDeleteYou both seem to be saying . . . .
"Yes, our guy is bad, but your guy was even worse!"
Even if we could settle that point, how do we dig our nation out of the mess we all agree we are in?
I lay much of the responsibility for change on CONGRESS. It has the power effect change, or at least slow it up, but mostly chooses to remain silent. We need to understand why.
In my book, COMPLACENT and COMPLICIT mean the same thing.
Fred Windish
A 2011 DOD report states that since June 2011, 4,486 US troops have died in Iraq,....1950 have died in Afghanistan....and 2,676 have died by suicide. Over 10% were in Iraq and Afghanistan. Until the facts are revealed and the mental state of a person who may or may not have walked off post is revealed who are we to judge? Maybe there is validity to the situation, however a person who may have regrets about his mission or succumbed to grief of casualties of war could be danger to him or herself and fellow troops. I don't claim to know the answer.
ReplyDeleteWhen Our soldier disappeared it was reported He walked off His post.I don't know if this qualifies as desertion or unauthorized absence.At this point what difference does it make.
ReplyDeleteBecause we should just keep them in Gitmo indefinitely. East there Rummy.
ReplyDeleteEasy
ReplyDelete12:29, The fact that his fellow soldiers from hios own platoon have such a poor opinion of the guy speaks volumes to me. I can't believe we'd give up 5 jihadists for a deserter. Simply moronic. Defending it is even more moronic.
ReplyDeleteOnly 5? that's nothing. When you look at countries like israel, they would rather free 1000 convicted terrorist to save the life of one of their own.Cause one life of an israeli is worth that of 1000 palestinians. Surely, one american life is worth that of 5? is it not?
ReplyDeletePersonally, I don't care about releasing 5 guys who have been in prison 12 years to bring our guy home, or that he is an alleged deserter. The Afghan war was a disaster. Let's pull our people out and move on. Yeah, these guys may very well rejoin the effort, but the Taliban is very strong anyway and isn't going anywhere. 5 more - what does it matter? This isn't a precedent. If Americans are unfortunate enough to be kidnapped, they shouldn't expect the same to happen. Organizations like the Taliban are always seeking to kidnap Americans - that won't change one way or the other.
ReplyDelete12:29, The fact that his fellow soldiers from hios own platoon have such a poor opinion of the guy speaks volumes to me. I can't believe we'd give up 5 jihadists for a deserter. Simply moronic. Defending it is even more moronic.
ReplyDeleteWhat's moronic is not assuming there is WAY more to the story at the same time as assuming this President and all the civilian and military brass involved in these decisions are complete morons.
3:11 - BOH could give two shits about our soldier. He'd rather incarcerate indefinitely 5 things without a trial than to get our guy back. Either that or he just gets his rocks off bashing the President.
ReplyDeleteYes, I would rather prevent five jihadists from killing people than exchange them for a deserter. And they are being held in conformity with the Geneva conventions. But go ahead and defend them. Let us know that Obama is now standing up for the constitutional rights of terrorists, even though they are not US citizens.
ReplyDeleteA former lawyer assuming desertion without a trial. Shameful. Anyone putting on a uniform and going overseas to serve our country deserves unconditional support until a trial. How do you know for sure this situation was not a ruse to get a hero behind enemy lines to get important info. Sounds implausible but who are you to judge before all info is revealed. Then theres the the fact about how many of Pattons peers hated his guts and questioned his motives in the course of his leadership. So you wanna judge this guy based on what hes peers THOUGHT. Holy system of justice.
ReplyDeleteAs someone who served in the military, I know that what the fellows in his platoon say is very damning. I am not prepared to call him a deserter without a trial, but am also not prepared to trade five jihadists for him. To evesn argue this point betrays a rank partisanship that's dangerous for our national security.
ReplyDeleteSome men froze at the heat of battle on D Day others rushed onward. Who are we to judge and cast labels, especially without the facts and where other platoon members feel differently.
ReplyDeleteAll 5 have american blood on their hands-3 of the 5 held senior positions. Its been reported that 6 fellow soldiers were killed looking for this deserter.
ReplyDeleteUnbelievable move by Obama. This soldier deserted his post. Based on his e-mails he grew to hate his country and indicated that he would just fly the coop if given the opportunity. He is hardly a hero. 6 other soldiers died searching for him after he deserted. Who mourns for their parents? Who praises them as heroes? And this flake is exchanged for the top 5 Taliban operatives at Gitmo? It was a disgraceful act by a weak president.
ReplyDeleteI might give up 5 bad guys just to be able to prosecute this guy. But no other explanation makes sense.
ReplyDeleteI to served in the military and am a Vietnam Vet and gotta tell ya of one of the most moving experience I had. When in 2001 i read and saw the video of the 50 japanese fighter pilots who returned and met 50 survivors of pearl harbor at the arizona memorial. It was a private no fanfare ceremony that restored my faith in humanity. In my opinion you either put the jihadists on trial for war crimes or ya let them go.Trade them for a million gallons of oil apiece for all i care. Bottom line is we no longer need wars. Just a few carefully executed surgical strikes like Bin ladens death to cut the head off the snake.In the advent of drones do ya think that snake in north korea is gonna be out there reviewing his troops if he really fucks with uncle sam? Despite all our flaws i still have faith in our system,our leaders and our people. God Bless America.
ReplyDeleteI have absolutely no faith in Obama or our leaders, and most of the vets I know share that view. We count on each other, not the people who pretend they know what they are doing. Incidentally, you don't put POWs on trial. Their ass is ours for as long as the war lasts, be it one month or 100 years. Also, I have no idea whether you are a vet bc you don't ID yourself. Also, you don't sound like a combat vet. They fgenerally have a very poor view of authority, and for very good reason. But you seem to want to stick your nose right up there. You could be one of those pretend guys. I will say I am no combat vet. If you really are a combat vet, and not some troll, then I give you respect and say you are the only one i ever met who was so ready to hug their leaders.
ReplyDeleteSad to see you have joined the swift boat haters O'Hare. These chicken hawks attacked a real decorated combat veteran in John Kerry with their now proven bullshit attacks on him for political reasons. All for George Bush who valiantly protected the skies of Texas in the Air Force reserve.
ReplyDeleteWho gives a crap if you were in the Army. Unless you were in a combat zone, your duty in the Adirondacks or Germany is like an extended summer camp experience. Save the pathos for the baggers.
This is just another cheap shot at Obama using this POW as the pawn. Who gives a shoat what some of his platoon said. War is Hell and maybe he saw or knows some things going on in his platoon he didn't like or feared for his life, or something. Bad things happen in a war to innocent people. We aren't the boy scouts.
We just don't know, and neither do you or your fellow haters.
That does not stop Republican(read Dent) apologist like you to use this soldier to go after Obama. What exactly was the status of the Afghan prisoners? Were they still deemed high risk? Were they turned?
You don't know shit and neither do your Obama hating clown friends. You guys make yourselves look like the asses you are by your ridiculous overreaction.
I was an air force 54350, a service tech and they loved when i showed up. All sitting in the dark in their small base camps out in the middle of no where. Sometimes mash units, sometimes overrun, sometimes under attack with no power. I was not a combat soldier but i had a job to do no matter what the challenge. I am no hero but i did my job, I did it well and was lucky to come home in one piece. Let me tell you another thing, in basic training we all hated our leaders, those fucking DI's .Those abusive,condensending, no it all sons of bitches. But if you listened to those bastards you wound up with the skills to survive the hell of war. I dont have all the answers for all the bullshit we all go through in life but here i am in the autumn of my years and am still proud to say im an optimistic american. PS if ya wanna know what af 54350 is google it
ReplyDeleteThey aren't POW's. They are "enemy combatants" since they are not part of a government military force nor did the US declare war,
ReplyDeleteIt's is disgraceful that you would shamelessly call this guy a "deserter" based on no evidence whatsoever except spurious reports. It is also disgraceful, that as a veteran, you would allow the ONLY US prisoner left in the middle east to be left behind.
All so you can bash Obama.
Per Army protocol, it's better to have an American POW be in our custody (and tried by the UCMJ) than in enemy captivity.
ReplyDeleteFrank Luntz, a fellow Republican:
ReplyDelete"Pro Tip: Attacking the actions that led to the release of Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl is a surefire way to lose in 2014."
"There are many other legitimate issues to attack in 2014. Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl's release is not one of them."
"If one of your family was a held POW, would you want the U.S. president to act unilaterally to free them or wait for congressional approval?"
If one of my family were a POW bc he deserted, I'd want him to rot away.
ReplyDelete8:49, If i were defending this deserter,you'd be all over me for that, too. You don't give a shit about the issue. You are just out to attack the author.
ReplyDeleteOkay, so now your defense Perry Mason is to play victim. Proceed with your defense counselor
ReplyDeleteNo, I'm just pointing out that you have no interest in any of these issues, Blog Mentor. You are driven by hatred of anyone who refuses to accept your goofy conspiracy theories.
ReplyDeleteI'm not the blog mentor and I have very serious interest in this issue. I also have very serious interest in attacks on our President and our military. Leaving a POW behind is a disgrace and frankly makes me nauseous that a radical right wing partisan attack is being orchestrated once again.
ReplyDeleteSure. This has nothing to do with politics. That's your first mistake. Leaving a pow behind is a disgrace? I guesss we should have suspended combat operations during WWII to get POWs back. Especially the deserters. Eisenhower, Bradley, Marshall and Patton must have all been disgraces. Your whole point is idiotic.
ReplyDeleteOne of Obama's biggest blunders and his kool-aid drinking zealots are scrambling to defend him. His spin doctors are hard at work to justify this debacle. SOP for the Obama zombie nation.
ReplyDeleteDid Congress formally declare war on Afghanistan?
ReplyDeleteThe evidence coming out points strongly in the direction this fellow left his rifle and armor behind, the walked off base with little more than his clothes and a compass.
ReplyDeleteTwo questions for all the experts here.
First, does this act constitute desertion?
Second, even if he somehow returned after a day, or two, would this 'error' have led to his being promoted from Pfc directly to Staff Sergeant?
Fred Windish
There is no real evidence of anything yet. This is just another excuse to attack Obama. Like the boy who cried wolf, it is getting so old by now, it doesn't even resonate with the average American. The teabaggers have lost all credibility outside of their ranks. The Republican Party looks like a bunch of old fools.
ReplyDeleteThere is a reason the DOD wanted to do this deal and we have no idea. However, the usual nutjobs will weigh in.
The evidence provided is in the form of multiple first-person accounts from his unit and a New York Times report that a senior military official claims there was a note left behind. I realize the credibility of the New York Times is questionable, at best, so why would it provide this knowledge?
ReplyDeleteYour attempt to make discovery of what really happened here purely political, and calling anyone looking for truth names, is troubling. The gravity of what this 'trade' represents is HUGE, potentially dangerous to the safety of thousands, and at least demoralizing to troops who currently serve. Questions MUST be asked, and answered.
Fred Windish
Sure. This has nothing to do with politics. That's your first mistake. Leaving a pow behind is a disgrace? I guesss we should have suspended combat operations during WWII to get POWs back. Especially the deserters. Eisenhower, Bradley, Marshall and Patton must have all been disgraces. Your whole point is idiotic.
ReplyDeleteYour damn right leaving POWs behind when you have a swap to get them back is a disgrace. You have a twisted view of this President and it's causing you to spew vitriol and nonsense.
You're
ReplyDeleteFred Windish - I know. Even more HUGE than Ronald Reagan giving arms for hostages! What an outrage!
ReplyDelete3:41-
ReplyDeleteI couldn't say, Bill. I do believe blind allegiance to ANY political party is not wise.
Fred Windish
"What do you say to the families of the men who lost their lives looking for that idiot." .... Ill tell ya what to say. The same thing you tell the familys of those who died in Bengazi and the drunken cook in Viet Nam who died from snake bite grabben bananas off a tree. They died doing there duty serving their country. Some of you knucleheads sound very similar to the criticism coming from civilians I remember during the Viet Nam war.You can armchair quarterback all you want. There always seems to have to be a McCarthy era type witchunt to keep some of you knuckleheads busy. Just want you yahoos to keep practicing saying Madame President. just in case. Keep saying it so you wont be so tight lipped in 2017
ReplyDeleteTroops coming home is inevitable ... Bush negotiated the initial game plane for Iraqi withdrawal and had the guideline for Afghanistan future withdrawal.
ReplyDeletePlease note --- Cuba wants the closure of both the Guantanamo Prison camp and the Naval base . They are paid a rent yearly from the U.S government in accords with an rather long term pact that requires the US to pay a rather low rent. Cuba in protest doesn't accept the rent. Cuba wants the return of their subjects or citizens still in U.S. Federal jails due to their terrorist and spying activities on Cuban refugees in Florida.
ReplyDeleteCubans give two shits about Guantanamo. Cuban men only care about getting pussy till their nuts dry up and Cuban women only care about having enough kids to keep the nickels coming in. Now when the old man finally dies all bets are off since the revolution gig is up, unrest will rise to the surface and Marco Rubio will return in a boat like washington crossing the delaware.
ReplyDeleteCuban
I couldn't say, Bill. I do believe blind allegiance to ANY political party is not wise.
ReplyDeletePresenting logical counter arguments to the obvious calculated attack (the latest one) on the President is not necessarily blind allegiance. The right's arguments are usually exaggerated, untruthful, or stupid.
Who would have thought that in 2014, it would be the Republicans who were anti-military?
ReplyDeleteThis is not R v D. This is stupid v common sense. You don't give up 5 high risk Taliban for a deserter.
ReplyDeleteCommon sense? Sense for a curmudgeon who reads too much right wing pablum, perhaps.
ReplyDeleteWhereas most rational people say you don't abandon an American serviceman who's been captured because he allegedly was a deserter. Nor do you put a high price tag on Gitmo inmates that will be sent home next year anyway.
Bernie's motto - "Leave some men behind, as long as Obama's the President"
ReplyDeleteThis is ridiculous. I'd never go after a deserter. Any President who trades five jihadists for one deserter is unworthy of his office.
ReplyDelete“Regardless of the circumstances, whatever those circumstances may turn out to be, we still get an American soldier back if he’s held in captivity. Period. Full stop. We don’t condition that." -The President of the United States
ReplyDeleteBut BOH does. And radical right wing loons he reads. It's sad, really.
If you think the right is pissed now, could you imagine if Obama traded John Hinkley jr
ReplyDeleteI think it's safe to say that you are one of the people who thinks national security and military issues are political. That's what is sad. This weakenms us yet again. My objection to Obam is not so much his domestic policies, but the fact that he is the Neville Chamberlain of the 21st century. It is now beginning to appear that he ignored the advice of military advisors, too. % jihadists for a deserter. Incredibly stupid and weak.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.madmagazine.com/blog/2014/06/03/barack-obamas-unfortunate-new-movie
ReplyDeleteI think you are just looking at things through the now minority, neoconservative, Bush doctrine. We are done with war. We are done with the region. People like you live scared of everything - scared another group of ragtag jihadists will sneak box cutters onto airplanes. Scared those 5 bogeymen from Gitmo are going to come and ravish you while you sleep.
ReplyDeleteEnding the Bush doctrine is by no means Neville Chamberlain. I think you are very confused and drawing obtuse analogies between nazi Germany and sheep herders in Afghanistan.
But you can tell you just get your info from completely biased right wing screeds. It's obvious.
I posted this thread on Monday. It is now Thursday, and you are still flailing away. Move on. You've lost. Your attempt to politicize this matter makes you as foolish as the decision made by Obama.
ReplyDeleteAll said, There are many riled up vets out there. This line was the best I heard from an old Viet Nam vet from the conservative persuasion at the local pentagon meeting held almost daily over coffee at McDonalds. "Id kiss jane fondas ass before id leave that kid behind" Time will bring about whose got the right assumtions. I dont care whose the president no way would i bring the dilemma before congress before acting. Congress cant agree on which way is up
ReplyDelete